ASUS Sabertooth X58 Any Comments?

ASUS x58 Sabertooth
http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_I...h6J&templete=2

Senior citizen here, and my old ASUS P4S333 is still hanging in, but
doesn't have the speed anymore for my needs.
Looking at the Sabertooth, since I need long term reliability, and not
really into OC, well, maybe just a little.
Thinking about an i7-9xx CPU and 3x3GB of 1600XMP memory.

Any comments on this relatively new MB ???

Retired Sergeant wrote:
ASUS x58 Sabertooth
http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_I...h6J&templete=2

Senior citizen here, and my old ASUS P4S333 is still hanging in, but
doesn't have the speed anymore for my needs.
Looking at the Sabertooth, since I need long term reliability, and not
really into OC, well, maybe just a little.
Thinking about an i7-9xx CPU and 3x3GB of 1600XMP memory.

Any comments on this relatively new MB ???


Web coverage is very poor for that motherboard. I can't get decent
pictures, there is no review, and so on.

It has six DIMM slots, and you could install memory in sets of three DIMMs.
3x1GB or 3x2GB might be starting points, depending on your OS choice.

One of the faults I find with my most recently purchased motherboard,
is the slot mix. On your P4S533, you're used to a set of PCI slots,
and the cards used in them are likely single slot width. Modern
computers sometimes end up with 2 slot wide video cards in the
video card slot, which can cover up other slots. The end result,
is some pretty sad usage of the expansion slots. I can only use
about half of mine, before wires or wide cards get in the way.

On the Sabertooth, putting a video card in the primary slot, is
likely to cover the only available PCI slot. And that may limit
the opportunities to transfer any PCI cards you already own.
(I like my sound card and TV tuner cards - you can always
buy newer PCI Express ones if you want.) There is only one PCI
card slot. And Intel is in a rush, in the next generation, to
eliminate PCI entirely.

After slot analysis, you can do a quick check of the back panel
connectors.

http://dlsvr.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/LG...rtooth_X58.pdf

It looks like you can use one PS/2 device, either mouse or keyboard.
I use a PS/2 keyboard on mine, in the hope I'll never lose control
of the system. When I first built my system, I couldn't use the
USB mouse for about two minutes, until eventually the USB drivers
(built into WinXP) installed themselves. I'd much rather have two
full PS/2 connectors, but that is progress for you.

http://www.asus.com/websites/Global/...4I7PKe_500.jpg

I see

PS/2, 2 USB
TOSLINK (for SPDIF over optical to your home theater receiver)
2 USB, Firewire, ESATA
2 USB, ESATA
Ethernet, 2 USB3.0
6 analog audio

http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-131-665-Z02?$S640W$

These are the storage interface assets.

ICH10R ---- (6) SATA 3Gbit/sec interfaces (mobo, dual right angle connectors)

JMB362 ---- (2) ESATA 3Gbit/sec in back I/O area

88SE9128 ---- (2) SATA 6Gbit/sec interfaces (mobo, dual right angle connector)

Additional assets.

NEC D720200 -------- (2) USB3 in I/O area

VT6308 Firewire ---- Firewire 400 in I/O area

Realtek 8110SC ----- LAN connector in I/O area

Those have to be connected to the chipset. How they're connected is
important, because some motherboards only have half the necessary
bandwidth for the USB3 chip. The D720200 and the 88SE9128 work best
if connected to a PCI Express x1 revision 2 port at 500MB/sec. That
would allow some of the bandwidth numbers you see here to be a
reality later in the life of the motherboard.

(336 MB/sec to an external USB3 hard drive enclosure, some day)
http://www.nordichardware.com/index....ticle&id=20792

If you start with a picture of the chipset, you can see all the available
PCI Express lanes here. x16, x16, x4 on Northbridge, x6 total on Southbridge
(with DMI as a bottleneck ?).

http://www.clunk.org.uk/images/revie...ockdiagram.png

Since Asus doesn't provide an architecture drawing like Gigabyte does,
we have to guess how the PCI Espress are connected. What I'm interested in,
is whether the D720200 and 88SE9128 get PCI Express x1 Revision 2 (500MB/sec)
connections or not, for full performance. You can see someone
here, checking out the various options with other chipset combinations.
They're attempting to do the same kind of analysis I'm interested in.
(It is a way to differentiate the current generation of motherboards,
whether their add-on USB3 and SATA3 chips are full bandwidth or
are bottlenecked. Asus uses the word "True" to describe their
motherboard, but I like to verify there are enough resources on
the motherboard to live up to such a claim.)

http://vr-zone.com/articles/gigabyte...ysis/8158.html

My problem is, based on reading the Asus manual, and seeing the note about,
adding a card to one of the PCI Express x1 slots, causes the x4 slot to run in
x1 mode, I can't figure out exactly how all the lanes are connected. Some
other interface or device should be tied into the x1/x4 mode issue.

So, while I can see a way of connecting the 88SE9128 (SATA3) and
D720200 (USB3) properly, I can't figure out which other chip
is "swinging" on the Southbridge PCI Express revision 1 ports.
The Southbridge can be run as (6) x1 or as x4,x1,x1, but if
you're going to lane switch the x4 interface, to support
both modes, then I feel two things have to swing as a result.
One of the PCI Express x1 slots interacts with that feature,
but the other affected chip isn't mentioned. For example, they
could tie both PCI Express x1 slots into the scheme, but the
Asus user manual is careful to suggest the second PCI Express x1
slot is not implicated (as it is useful for "full performance").
So that means some chip could be robbed of its interface, in
order for the third large PCI Express slot to run at x4. They
could always run the third large PCI Express slot in x1 mode
all the time (and use no lane switches at all), but then that
would make a lie out of the x4 operating mode claim.

Processor
|
|
X58 ------------- PCI Express x16 video
| ------------- PCI Express x16 video
| ---- x4 --- x2 mode gen2 ---- 88SE9128
| --- x2 mode gen2 ---- D720200
|
ICH10R ----------- x4 --- 3 lane transmission switch ??? ---- x1/x4 on x16 slot
| \__ PCI-E x1 slot
|
| ??? JMB362 ESATA
|
| ----------- x1 --- 8110SC LAN
| ----------- x1 --- PCI-E x1 slot
|
+-------- PCI ----------- VT6308

Asus still hasn't figured out, that the architecture diagram Gigabyte
adds to their manuals, is valuable information for end users.

Anyway, it looks like a pretty ordinary board, in terms of having
features that other motherboards have. So compare the add-in slot
mix to any other board that has "true" 500MB/sec connections
(PCI Express x1 Revision 2) connections to the 88SE9128 and D720200.
And make up your mind that way. In Asus case here, there would
have been less uncertainty, if they just replaced that third
large PCI Express slot, with a PCI card slot instead.

Paul

On Wed, 01 Sep 2010 13:34:46 -0400, Paul wrote:

Retired Sergeant wrote:
ASUS x58 Sabertooth
http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_I...h6J&templete=2

Senior citizen here, and my old ASUS P4S333 is still hanging in, but
doesn't have the speed anymore for my needs.
Looking at the Sabertooth, since I need long term reliability, and not
really into OC, well, maybe just a little.
Thinking about an i7-9xx CPU and 3x3GB of 1600XMP memory.

Any comments on this relatively new MB ???


Web coverage is very poor for that motherboard. I can't get decent
pictures, there is no review, and so on.

It has six DIMM slots, and you could install memory in sets of three DIMMs.
3x1GB or 3x2GB might be starting points, depending on your OS choice.

One of the faults I find with my most recently purchased motherboard,
is the slot mix. On your P4S533, you're used to a set of PCI slots,
and the cards used in them are likely single slot width. Modern
computers sometimes end up with 2 slot wide video cards in the
video card slot, which can cover up other slots. The end result,
is some pretty sad usage of the expansion slots. I can only use
about half of mine, before wires or wide cards get in the way.

On the Sabertooth, putting a video card in the primary slot, is
likely to cover the only available PCI slot. And that may limit
the opportunities to transfer any PCI cards you already own.
(I like my sound card and TV tuner cards - you can always
buy newer PCI Express ones if you want.) There is only one PCI
card slot. And Intel is in a rush, in the next generation, to
eliminate PCI entirely.

After slot analysis, you can do a quick check of the back panel
connectors.

http://dlsvr.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/LG...rtooth_X58.pdf

It looks like you can use one PS/2 device, either mouse or keyboard.
I use a PS/2 keyboard on mine, in the hope I'll never lose control
of the system. When I first built my system, I couldn't use the
USB mouse for about two minutes, until eventually the USB drivers
(built into WinXP) installed themselves. I'd much rather have two
full PS/2 connectors, but that is progress for you.

http://www.asus.com/websites/Global/...4I7PKe_500.jpg

I see

PS/2, 2 USB
TOSLINK (for SPDIF over optical to your home theater receiver)
2 USB, Firewire, ESATA
2 USB, ESATA
Ethernet, 2 USB3.0
6 analog audio

http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-131-665-Z02?$S640W$

These are the storage interface assets.

ICH10R ---- (6) SATA 3Gbit/sec interfaces (mobo, dual right angle connectors)

JMB362 ---- (2) ESATA 3Gbit/sec in back I/O area

88SE9128 ---- (2) SATA 6Gbit/sec interfaces (mobo, dual right angle connector)

Additional assets.

NEC D720200 -------- (2) USB3 in I/O area

VT6308 Firewire ---- Firewire 400 in I/O area

Realtek 8110SC ----- LAN connector in I/O area

Those have to be connected to the chipset. How they're connected is
important, because some motherboards only have half the necessary
bandwidth for the USB3 chip. The D720200 and the 88SE9128 work best
if connected to a PCI Express x1 revision 2 port at 500MB/sec. That
would allow some of the bandwidth numbers you see here to be a
reality later in the life of the motherboard.

(336 MB/sec to an external USB3 hard drive enclosure, some day)
http://www.nordichardware.com/index....ticle&id=20792

If you start with a picture of the chipset, you can see all the available
PCI Express lanes here. x16, x16, x4 on Northbridge, x6 total on Southbridge
(with DMI as a bottleneck ?).

http://www.clunk.org.uk/images/revie...ockdiagram.png

Since Asus doesn't provide an architecture drawing like Gigabyte does,
we have to guess how the PCI Espress are connected. What I'm interested in,
is whether the D720200 and 88SE9128 get PCI Express x1 Revision 2 (500MB/sec)
connections or not, for full performance. You can see someone
here, checking out the various options with other chipset combinations.
They're attempting to do the same kind of analysis I'm interested in.
(It is a way to differentiate the current generation of motherboards,
whether their add-on USB3 and SATA3 chips are full bandwidth or
are bottlenecked. Asus uses the word "True" to describe their
motherboard, but I like to verify there are enough resources on
the motherboard to live up to such a claim.)

http://vr-zone.com/articles/gigabyte...ysis/8158.html

My problem is, based on reading the Asus manual, and seeing the note about,
adding a card to one of the PCI Express x1 slots, causes the x4 slot to run in
x1 mode, I can't figure out exactly how all the lanes are connected. Some
other interface or device should be tied into the x1/x4 mode issue.

So, while I can see a way of connecting the 88SE9128 (SATA3) and
D720200 (USB3) properly, I can't figure out which other chip
is "swinging" on the Southbridge PCI Express revision 1 ports.
The Southbridge can be run as (6) x1 or as x4,x1,x1, but if
you're going to lane switch the x4 interface, to support
both modes, then I feel two things have to swing as a result.
One of the PCI Express x1 slots interacts with that feature,
but the other affected chip isn't mentioned. For example, they
could tie both PCI Express x1 slots into the scheme, but the
Asus user manual is careful to suggest the second PCI Express x1
slot is not implicated (as it is useful for "full performance").
So that means some chip could be robbed of its interface, in
order for the third large PCI Express slot to run at x4. They
could always run the third large PCI Express slot in x1 mode
all the time (and use no lane switches at all), but then that
would make a lie out of the x4 operating mode claim.

Processor
|
|
X58 ------------- PCI Express x16 video
| ------------- PCI Express x16 video
| ---- x4 --- x2 mode gen2 ---- 88SE9128
| --- x2 mode gen2 ---- D720200
|
ICH10R ----------- x4 --- 3 lane transmission switch ??? ---- x1/x4 on x16 slot
| \__ PCI-E x1 slot
|
| ??? JMB362 ESATA
|
| ----------- x1 --- 8110SC LAN
| ----------- x1 --- PCI-E x1 slot
|
+-------- PCI ----------- VT6308

Asus still hasn't figured out, that the architecture diagram Gigabyte
adds to their manuals, is valuable information for end users.

Anyway, it looks like a pretty ordinary board, in terms of having
features that other motherboards have. So compare the add-in slot
mix to any other board that has "true" 500MB/sec connections
(PCI Express x1 Revision 2) connections to the 88SE9128 and D720200.
And make up your mind that way. In Asus case here, there would
have been less uncertainty, if they just replaced that third
large PCI Express slot, with a PCI card slot instead.

Paul

Thank you for all that information. I will be looking
into all the items. Your help is greatly appreciated.

QX wrote:


Anyway, it looks like a pretty ordinary board, in terms of having
features that other motherboards have. So compare the add-in slot
mix to any other board that has "true" 500MB/sec connections
(PCI Express x1 Revision 2) connections to the 88SE9128 and D720200.
And make up your mind that way. In Asus case here, there would
have been less uncertainty, if they just replaced that third
large PCI Express slot, with a PCI card slot instead.

Paul

Thank you for all that information. I will be looking
into all the items. Your help is greatly appreciated.

New motherboards have their pluses and minuses. Different
connectors and a wide range of expansion slots, mean you
might not be getting exactly what you want. But the new
processors that go in them are definitely faster.

Paul