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#21
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Rob Stow wrote:
Michael wrote: But hasn't ATI continued to build/release up to date Radeon cpu based video cards? They're pretty high tech? OTOH, the PCI Radeon cards are much more expensive than similar AGP based video cards? No, the Radeon 9200's and 9200SE's are very similarly priced for the AGP and PCI versions - and at some vendors they have *exactly* the same price. For example, about five weeks ago I bought four 128 MB ATI Radeon 9200 PCI cards for $139.95 each at FutureShop (Canadian electronics store chain). The AGP version of the card at that store had exactly the same price. Are you sure though the PCI cards have a 128bit memory interface? AFAIK PCI cards always have the name "9200" and not "9200SE" even if in fact sometimes they only have the 64bit interface (you can see it easily, if they have only 4 (tsop) memory chips in total, then they have a 64bit memory interface). And of course these 9200 cards are not exactly "up to date", they might not be that old but the technology is rather outdated. Roland |
#22
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Roland Scheidegger wrote:
Rob Stow wrote: Michael wrote: But hasn't ATI continued to build/release up to date Radeon cpu based video cards? They're pretty high tech? OTOH, the PCI Radeon cards are much more expensive than similar AGP based video cards? No, the Radeon 9200's and 9200SE's are very similarly priced for the AGP and PCI versions - and at some vendors they have *exactly* the same price. For example, about five weeks ago I bought four 128 MB ATI Radeon 9200 PCI cards for $139.95 each at FutureShop (Canadian electronics store chain). The AGP version of the card at that store had exactly the same price. Are you sure though the PCI cards have a 128bit memory interface? AFAIK PCI cards always have the name "9200" and not "9200SE" even if in fact sometimes they only have the 64bit interface (you can see it easily, if they have only 4 (tsop) memory chips in total, then they have a 64bit memory interface). And of course these 9200 cards are not exactly "up to date", they might not be that old but the technology is rather outdated. Umm you can make a 128bit interface by just moving it twice rather than once. The PCI bus doesn't support 128bit wide datatransfers anyway so you just write twice. Another reason why AGP rules Though i would still like to see a dual AGP system one day. |
#23
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Piotr Makley wrote:
Yoyoma_2 wrote: Though i would still like to see a dual AGP system one day. Do you mean to say that there are almost no dual monitor AGP graphics cards? There are many, many, dual monitor AGP cards out there - it has almost become the standard for AGP cards. Hence I took her (his?) remark as intending to convey a desire for a machine with more than one AGP slot, to which the answer is, "Forget it - it ain't going to happen." Especially now with PCI-Express just around the corner. |
#24
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Yoyoma_2 schrieb:
Roland Scheidegger wrote: Are you sure though the PCI cards have a 128bit memory interface? AFAIK PCI cards always have the name "9200" and not "9200SE" even if in fact sometimes they only have the 64bit interface (you can see it easily, if they have only 4 (tsop) memory chips in total, then they have a 64bit memory interface). Umm you can make a 128bit interface by just moving it twice rather than once. The PCI bus doesn't support 128bit wide datatransfers anyway so you just write twice. Another reason why AGP rules Ahem. Roland was not referring to the system-to-graphics-card interface, but the card's own memory interface. Apart from this, your first statement is just plain wrong. Some graphics card basics may not hurt... Stephan -- Meine Andere Seite: http://stephan.win31.de/ PC#6: i440BX, 1xP3-500E, 512 MiB, 18+80 GB, R9k AGP 64 MiB, 110W This is a SCSI-inside, Legacy-plus, TCPA-free computer Mail to From: not read, see homepg. | Real gelesene Mailadr. s. Homep. |
#25
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Piotr Makley wrote:
Yoyoma_2 wrote: Are you sure though the PCI cards have a 128bit memory interface? AFAIK PCI cards always have the name "9200" and not "9200SE" even if in fact sometimes they only have the 64bit interface (you can see it easily, if they have only 4 (tsop) memory chips in total, then they have a 64bit memory interface). And of course these 9200 cards are not exactly "up to date", they might not be that old but the technology is rather outdated. Umm you can make a 128bit interface by just moving it twice rather than once. The PCI bus doesn't support 128bit wide datatransfers anyway so you just write twice. Another reason why AGP rules Though i would still like to see a dual AGP system one day. Do you mean to say that there are almost no dual monitor AGP graphics cards? No i mean there are almost no boards with dual AGP slots where you can add a 2 quad monitor AGP cards if you want |
#26
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Rob Stow wrote:
Piotr Makley wrote: Yoyoma_2 wrote: Though i would still like to see a dual AGP system one day. Do you mean to say that there are almost no dual monitor AGP graphics cards? There are many, many, dual monitor AGP cards out there - it has almost become the standard for AGP cards. Hence I took her (his?) remark as intending to convey a desire for a machine with more than one AGP slot, to which the answer is, "Forget it - it ain't going to happen." Especially now with PCI-Express just around the corner. Yeah i clarified that in another post. The original intent was because PCI-66mhz is still pretty slow, especially when handling large data. PCI-X is really good but your right its not adopted yet. But what would prevent a dual AGP slot motherboard? It could be usefull when trying to render high-performance simulations that are sectioned. Though i don't know if the bus supports it. From what i know, PCI-X still won't have the same kind of access that the AGP card has, like having to go through a PCI bridge, direct access to memory with textures etc... |
#27
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Yoyoma_2 wrote:
Rob Stow wrote: Piotr Makley wrote: Yoyoma_2 wrote: Though i would still like to see a dual AGP system one day. Do you mean to say that there are almost no dual monitor AGP graphics cards? There are many, many, dual monitor AGP cards out there - it has almost become the standard for AGP cards. Hence I took her (his?) remark as intending to convey a desire for a machine with more than one AGP slot, to which the answer is, "Forget it - it ain't going to happen." Especially now with PCI-Express just around the corner. Yeah i clarified that in another post. The original intent was because PCI-66mhz is still pretty slow, especially when handling large data. PCI-X is really good but your right its not adopted yet. But what would prevent a dual AGP slot motherboard? It could be usefull when trying to render high-performance simulations that are sectioned. Though i don't know if the bus supports it. From what i know, PCI-X still won't have the same kind of access that the AGP card has, like having to go through a PCI bridge, direct access to memory with textures etc... sorry forgot a "not" somewhere. like NOT having to go through a pci bridge. |
#28
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Yoyoma_2 wrote:
Yeah i clarified that in another post. The original intent was because PCI-66mhz is still pretty slow, especially when handling large data. PCI-X is really good but your right its not adopted yet. But what would prevent a dual AGP slot motherboard? It could be usefull when trying to render high-performance simulations that are sectioned. Though i don't know if the bus supports it. Don't confuse PCI-X with PCI-Express. PCI-X is just an extension of PCI and well adopted (in the server market). PCI-X might die together with PCI and be replaced with PCI-Express though I guess it will take some time (those markets don't adopt new standards fast). From what i know, PCI-X still won't have the same kind of access that the AGP card has, like having not to go through a PCI bridge, direct access to memory with textures etc... I don't think PCI-Express will miss any features which might make it slower than AGP (PCI-X possibly yes, but then again I don't think PCI-X graphic cards exist). And AGP isn't really all that different from PCI anyway (AGP1x was basically just PCI-66 (32bit), in fact on the good old bx chipset the agp port can be used as PCI-66 instead - of course the board manufacturer has to decide that). |
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