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AIW 128 pci, MMC 7.2 and SVCD capture?



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 23rd 03, 06:30 PM
Doug M
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default AIW 128 pci, MMC 7.2 and SVCD capture?

I'm a total video capture newbie, but I'd like to capture SVCD video
directly. Is this possible with my old AIW 128 16MB PCI? I've set the
settings to 480x480, about 2MB bitrate, but my only options for sound
are 22KHz. I'm using the latest software for the card from ATI's
site. The VCD preset is too blocky and fuzzy to suit me. ATI's site
says I downloaded MMC 7.2, but the help icon on lauchpad says
launchpad is 7.1.

I'm running an AMD Athlon 1800+ on an ECS K7S5A motherboard. 80BGB
hdd with WinXP home, 120 GB HDD dedicated for capture, master/slave on
IDE 0. DVD drive as master on IDE 1. 512MB PC2100.

I always get stuttery capture even with only 50% cpu usage, noticeable
only in slow panning shots. I also see where I should be able to
select IPB (if I have the terminology correct) with 12 of P, 4 B (or
thereabouts) according to the help files that came with the drivers.
I can't change it from 4 and 2. ???? Should I disable my NIC when
capturing?

I can't capture at full-frame, full-motion MPEG2 with this setup, uses
100% cpu with dropped frames. Does this sound right?

Here are the drivers and files I downloaded from ATI:
WXP_R128_6_13_3279.exe
Windows XP Display Driver for ATI RAGE 128 / RAGE128 PRO

MMC 7.2 no DVD

DVD 5.0 upgrade

It's all so confusing.
  #2  
Old July 24th 03, 10:36 AM
Graeme Ellis
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Don't know if this helps, but I have an old AIW PRO PCI, the one before your
card. I have it setup to PVR the dish
And spent a few weeks trying different OS/MMC/Driver combos

First, The 7.2 drivers do display 7.1 on the TV app.

I didn't use XP home but tried both 98SE & ME with the same results.

I found that installing the latest ME/9X drivers from ATI then not
uninstalling but installing the latest ME or 98 Rage video only drivers
allowed me to capture up to 720x480 with no frame drops on a PII 266 (an
Intergraph TD225 with a SB16). The sound was 800ms out of sync however. I
then proceeded to screw the setup and have never been able to quite get back
to that config. I found the latest drivers cause a slow down 38-60 % frame
lose and slows the system clock too.

But I can do 480x480 44.1Khz 8bit on my PIII 500 deskpro EN. I did find
that creating a new profile would not give the same results as copying one
of the built-in profiles, just edit one of the built-in profiles to make a
copy. I used the Longest Time one, selected MPEG2, 480x480, dropped the
sound down to 8bit as the builtin sound is not up to 16 bit at that speed.
It gradually loses sync it's about 9Khz under 44100Khz. Great guide on
DVDRHELP.COM to fix this. With P Frames @ 4, B frames @ 2, bitrate set to
2.75Mb, Motion Estimate Quality is 99, 32 &16 for the Motion settings. I do
not lose any frames nnd the video stays in sync with the picture quality
very good. TMPGEnc supports the output but I have to re-encode to VCD or
SVCD. BTW I used a the built-in Intel 10/100 pro on the EN & a similar Intel
10/100 card in the Intergraph workstation with no problems as long as you
are not copying files around to/from the capture PC while recording. I think
the major degrader is HD speed.

You'll have to excuse any of my ego but I spent a lot of time getting the
P.O.S. to work as good as I did. Again not sure if this helps, you could try
MMC 7.5 though I found I could not get it to capture with the same no frame
loss as 7.5 and 7.7 would not work at all. I believe that MMC 7.7 will work
for your card.

BTW the builtin sound may be your problem, ditch it and use a good PCI card.
AC97 audio has a high CPU utilization.





"Doug M" wrote in message
...
I'm a total video capture newbie, but I'd like to capture SVCD video
directly. Is this possible with my old AIW 128 16MB PCI? I've set the
settings to 480x480, about 2MB bitrate, but my only options for sound
are 22KHz. I'm using the latest software for the card from ATI's
site. The VCD preset is too blocky and fuzzy to suit me. ATI's site
says I downloaded MMC 7.2, but the help icon on lauchpad says
launchpad is 7.1.

I'm running an AMD Athlon 1800+ on an ECS K7S5A motherboard. 80BGB
hdd with WinXP home, 120 GB HDD dedicated for capture, master/slave on
IDE 0. DVD drive as master on IDE 1. 512MB PC2100.

I always get stuttery capture even with only 50% cpu usage, noticeable
only in slow panning shots. I also see where I should be able to
select IPB (if I have the terminology correct) with 12 of P, 4 B (or
thereabouts) according to the help files that came with the drivers.
I can't change it from 4 and 2. ???? Should I disable my NIC when
capturing?

I can't capture at full-frame, full-motion MPEG2 with this setup, uses
100% cpu with dropped frames. Does this sound right?

Here are the drivers and files I downloaded from ATI:
WXP_R128_6_13_3279.exe
Windows XP Display Driver for ATI RAGE 128 / RAGE128 PRO

MMC 7.2 no DVD

DVD 5.0 upgrade

It's all so confusing.



  #3  
Old July 24th 03, 06:17 PM
Doug M
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default



My guess is no. MMC 7.7 has a SVCD setting but MMC 7.6 doesn't. I have tons
of problems when I used ATI MMC 6.0 to 7.6 in two years' span. Everything is
fine once I used MMC 7.7.

I can run ATI MMC 7.7 with AIW 128 pro, AIW 7500 and AIW 8500, but not with
the AIW 128 which doesn't have the "theater chip". You have to buy a new
video card!



Im pretty sure my card does have the Rage Theater chip. I've looked
at it. If that's the case, can I use MMC 7.7? It's a very late PCI
card.

If I do use MMC 7.7, do I just download it and run the install? How
about uninstalling the stuff I have now? I'm not afraid of a fresh
install of Windoze; the PC is just for my entertainment center and all
my saved videos are on the separate disk. ...but I'd rather not have
to reinstall if I don't have to.
  #4  
Old July 24th 03, 06:24 PM
Doug M
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thanks for your thoughts. It's nice not to have to re-invent the
wheel if I don't have to. I have an old PCI Creative Ensonique card.
Would that be any better than the onboard sound? I have a Creative
Live! in my other PC that I could use. ...not the 5.1, but the older
one.

My on-board sound and my video card are sharing IRQ 5. I have several
available IRQ's, but this board's BIOS is rather a limited one
compared to my Abit board. I'm not sure I want to go messing with
manually configuring IRQ's in the BIOS. I had to move the card around
until I found a slot it would work in at all. I could only capture at
the "best settings" on the preconfigured settings. My system would
crash if I tried to play back any other settings. ...appeared to
record, but system BSOD'd every time I'd try to play anything other
than the full frame capure.

I was gonna buy a faster CPU, but maybe I'll try a better sound card.



On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 09:36:34 GMT, "Graeme Ellis"
wrote:

Don't know if this helps, but I have an old AIW PRO PCI, the one before your
card. I have it setup to PVR the dish
And spent a few weeks trying different OS/MMC/Driver combos

First, The 7.2 drivers do display 7.1 on the TV app.

I didn't use XP home but tried both 98SE & ME with the same results.

I found that installing the latest ME/9X drivers from ATI then not
uninstalling but installing the latest ME or 98 Rage video only drivers
allowed me to capture up to 720x480 with no frame drops on a PII 266 (an
Intergraph TD225 with a SB16). The sound was 800ms out of sync however. I
then proceeded to screw the setup and have never been able to quite get back
to that config. I found the latest drivers cause a slow down 38-60 % frame
lose and slows the system clock too.

But I can do 480x480 44.1Khz 8bit on my PIII 500 deskpro EN. I did find
that creating a new profile would not give the same results as copying one
of the built-in profiles, just edit one of the built-in profiles to make a
copy. I used the Longest Time one, selected MPEG2, 480x480, dropped the
sound down to 8bit as the builtin sound is not up to 16 bit at that speed.
It gradually loses sync it's about 9Khz under 44100Khz. Great guide on
DVDRHELP.COM to fix this. With P Frames @ 4, B frames @ 2, bitrate set to
2.75Mb, Motion Estimate Quality is 99, 32 &16 for the Motion settings. I do
not lose any frames nnd the video stays in sync with the picture quality
very good. TMPGEnc supports the output but I have to re-encode to VCD or
SVCD. BTW I used a the built-in Intel 10/100 pro on the EN & a similar Intel
10/100 card in the Intergraph workstation with no problems as long as you
are not copying files around to/from the capture PC while recording. I think
the major degrader is HD speed.

You'll have to excuse any of my ego but I spent a lot of time getting the
P.O.S. to work as good as I did. Again not sure if this helps, you could try
MMC 7.5 though I found I could not get it to capture with the same no frame
loss as 7.5 and 7.7 would not work at all. I believe that MMC 7.7 will work
for your card.

BTW the builtin sound may be your problem, ditch it and use a good PCI card.
AC97 audio has a high CPU utilization.





"Doug M" wrote in message
.. .
I'm a total video capture newbie, but I'd like to capture SVCD video
directly. Is this possible with my old AIW 128 16MB PCI? I've set the
settings to 480x480, about 2MB bitrate, but my only options for sound
are 22KHz. I'm using the latest software for the card from ATI's
site. The VCD preset is too blocky and fuzzy to suit me. ATI's site
says I downloaded MMC 7.2, but the help icon on lauchpad says
launchpad is 7.1.

I'm running an AMD Athlon 1800+ on an ECS K7S5A motherboard. 80BGB
hdd with WinXP home, 120 GB HDD dedicated for capture, master/slave on
IDE 0. DVD drive as master on IDE 1. 512MB PC2100.

I always get stuttery capture even with only 50% cpu usage, noticeable
only in slow panning shots. I also see where I should be able to
select IPB (if I have the terminology correct) with 12 of P, 4 B (or
thereabouts) according to the help files that came with the drivers.
I can't change it from 4 and 2. ???? Should I disable my NIC when
capturing?

I can't capture at full-frame, full-motion MPEG2 with this setup, uses
100% cpu with dropped frames. Does this sound right?

Here are the drivers and files I downloaded from ATI:
WXP_R128_6_13_3279.exe
Windows XP Display Driver for ATI RAGE 128 / RAGE128 PRO

MMC 7.2 no DVD

DVD 5.0 upgrade

It's all so confusing.



  #5  
Old July 24th 03, 08:32 PM
Ar Q
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Doug M" wrote in message
...


My guess is no. MMC 7.7 has a SVCD setting but MMC 7.6 doesn't. I have

tons
of problems when I used ATI MMC 6.0 to 7.6 in two years' span. Everything

is
fine once I used MMC 7.7.

I can run ATI MMC 7.7 with AIW 128 pro, AIW 7500 and AIW 8500, but not

with
the AIW 128 which doesn't have the "theater chip". You have to buy a new
video card!



Im pretty sure my card does have the Rage Theater chip. I've looked
at it. If that's the case, can I use MMC 7.7? It's a very late PCI
card.

If I do use MMC 7.7, do I just download it and run the install? How
about uninstalling the stuff I have now? I'm not afraid of a fresh
install of Windoze; the PC is just for my entertainment center and all
my saved videos are on the separate disk. ...but I'd rather not have
to reinstall if I don't have to.


Do a Google search. There are tons of post on this subject.

In short, I will recommend a fresh installation. If you have to unintall the
previous version, you also need to clean all registry.

The procedures of fresh installation.
1. Install Direct X 8.1. Reboot.
2. Install MS media player 7.0 or 7.1. Reboot.
3. Install the capture driver (Radeon and Rage Pro uses the same capture
driver. You have to follow Radeon card path to get this driver. Also,
Catalyst 2.1 is very good for ATI MMC 7.7.) Don't reboot. Install display
driver (make sure use the correct display driver, you can't use Redeon
display driver.) Reboot.
4. Install ATI MMC 7.6 no DVD. Reboot.
5. Install ATI MMC 7.6 DVD player. Reboot.
6. Install ATI MMC 7.7 update. Reboot.


  #6  
Old July 24th 03, 10:45 PM
patrickp
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Doug M" wrote in message
...
Thanks for your thoughts. It's nice not to have to re-invent the
wheel if I don't have to. I have an old PCI Creative Ensonique card.
Would that be any better than the onboard sound? I have a Creative
Live! in my other PC that I could use. ...not the 5.1, but the older
one.

My on-board sound and my video card are sharing IRQ 5. I have several
available IRQ's, but this board's BIOS is rather a limited one
compared to my Abit board. I'm not sure I want to go messing with
manually configuring IRQ's in the BIOS. I had to move the card around
until I found a slot it would work in at all. I could only capture at
the "best settings" on the preconfigured settings. My system would
crash if I tried to play back any other settings. ...appeared to
record, but system BSOD'd every time I'd try to play anything other
than the full frame capure.

I was gonna buy a faster CPU, but maybe I'll try a better sound card.


Graphics card and sound card sharing an IRQ is not a good idea - try moving
the sound card to a different slot. Secondly, you already have a well fast
enough CPU: the problem is your old PCI card; the rest of your system, as
well, seems Ok. It's the card that's the bottleneck. I can capture quite
happily with a CPU half the speed of yours, but using a Radeon AGP VIVO.

For what you want to do, an AGP card would be a much better investment;
also, if you invest in an AIW 128 Pro rather than AIW 128, or even better, a
low end Radeon AIW or VIVO, you'll not only get better performance, you'll
be able to run the later software.

patrickp


On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 09:36:34 GMT, "Graeme Ellis"
wrote:

Don't know if this helps, but I have an old AIW PRO PCI, the one before

your
card. I have it setup to PVR the dish
And spent a few weeks trying different OS/MMC/Driver combos

First, The 7.2 drivers do display 7.1 on the TV app.

I didn't use XP home but tried both 98SE & ME with the same results.

I found that installing the latest ME/9X drivers from ATI then not
uninstalling but installing the latest ME or 98 Rage video only drivers
allowed me to capture up to 720x480 with no frame drops on a PII 266 (an
Intergraph TD225 with a SB16). The sound was 800ms out of sync however. I
then proceeded to screw the setup and have never been able to quite get

back
to that config. I found the latest drivers cause a slow down 38-60 %

frame
lose and slows the system clock too.

But I can do 480x480 44.1Khz 8bit on my PIII 500 deskpro EN. I did find
that creating a new profile would not give the same results as copying

one
of the built-in profiles, just edit one of the built-in profiles to make

a
copy. I used the Longest Time one, selected MPEG2, 480x480, dropped the
sound down to 8bit as the builtin sound is not up to 16 bit at that

speed.
It gradually loses sync it's about 9Khz under 44100Khz. Great guide on
DVDRHELP.COM to fix this. With P Frames @ 4, B frames @ 2, bitrate set to
2.75Mb, Motion Estimate Quality is 99, 32 &16 for the Motion settings. I

do
not lose any frames nnd the video stays in sync with the picture quality
very good. TMPGEnc supports the output but I have to re-encode to VCD or
SVCD. BTW I used a the built-in Intel 10/100 pro on the EN & a similar

Intel
10/100 card in the Intergraph workstation with no problems as long as you
are not copying files around to/from the capture PC while recording. I

think
the major degrader is HD speed.

You'll have to excuse any of my ego but I spent a lot of time getting the
P.O.S. to work as good as I did. Again not sure if this helps, you could

try
MMC 7.5 though I found I could not get it to capture with the same no

frame
loss as 7.5 and 7.7 would not work at all. I believe that MMC 7.7 will

work
for your card.

BTW the builtin sound may be your problem, ditch it and use a good PCI

card.
AC97 audio has a high CPU utilization.





"Doug M" wrote in message
.. .
I'm a total video capture newbie, but I'd like to capture SVCD video
directly. Is this possible with my old AIW 128 16MB PCI? I've set the
settings to 480x480, about 2MB bitrate, but my only options for sound
are 22KHz. I'm using the latest software for the card from ATI's
site. The VCD preset is too blocky and fuzzy to suit me. ATI's site
says I downloaded MMC 7.2, but the help icon on lauchpad says
launchpad is 7.1.

I'm running an AMD Athlon 1800+ on an ECS K7S5A motherboard. 80BGB
hdd with WinXP home, 120 GB HDD dedicated for capture, master/slave on
IDE 0. DVD drive as master on IDE 1. 512MB PC2100.

I always get stuttery capture even with only 50% cpu usage, noticeable
only in slow panning shots. I also see where I should be able to
select IPB (if I have the terminology correct) with 12 of P, 4 B (or
thereabouts) according to the help files that came with the drivers.
I can't change it from 4 and 2. ???? Should I disable my NIC when
capturing?

I can't capture at full-frame, full-motion MPEG2 with this setup, uses
100% cpu with dropped frames. Does this sound right?

Here are the drivers and files I downloaded from ATI:
WXP_R128_6_13_3279.exe
Windows XP Display Driver for ATI RAGE 128 / RAGE128 PRO

MMC 7.2 no DVD

DVD 5.0 upgrade

It's all so confusing.





 




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