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#11
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John Russell wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote in message ... RaceFace wrote: "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. However new high performance motherboards that support AGP are going to be increasingly rare. Intel has dropped AGP support from their new chipsets entirely and nvidia, via, and sis seem to be following their lead. -- --John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) It makes sense to them to make people think they have to have PCI-e now. System builders are building systems from scratch and don't have to worry about users wanting to use some of their current build. Untill PCI-E is proven, reliable and actually produces significantly better performance than AGP systems there is no reason to see PCI-e as a "must have". And anyway we've heard all this before from Intel about AGP. Improving the speed of using "system memory" is not that important as graphics cards get more and more fast onboard memory. A graphics card which users AGPx8 without accessing system memory is better than a PCI-e card which does. I see PCI Express as more of a "stuck with" than a "must have". I think we would all have been better served if they had instead of PCI Express put PCI-X in their chipsets as a standard feature. But that wouldn't have forced one to upgrade any other components in order to replace a motherboard. -- --John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) |
#12
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I see PCI Express as more of a "stuck with" than a "must have". I think we would all have been better served if they had instead of PCI Express put PCI-X in their chipsets as a standard feature. But that wouldn't have forced one to upgrade any other components in order to replace a motherboard. -- --John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) It's interesting when the "industry" thinks it in control and control what people buy. Some company "breaks rank" and offers users an alternative. There was Nvidia thinking that Intel users wanting SLI would have to get Nforce5. Now gigabyte have produced SLI on a single card requring a normal PCI-e motherboard, and Intel users can continue to use Intel chipsets and have SLI! I doubt many people could afford to buy a twin card SLI as a complete PC solution, even if the system builders offer it. So for most SLI would be something to progress towards, and gigabyte have offered an alaternative way of doing that! |
#13
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"J. Clarke" wrote in message ... McGrandpa wrote: "RaceFace" wrote in message "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. But more likely, the top end cards will all be PCIx, and mid to low range cards for AGP. PCI-E. Not PCIX, despite nvidia's "PCX" brand name. PCIX is a 64-bit parallel bus that can accept regular PCI boards. It is different from PCI Express. And probably would have been a betters solution, with it's legecy compatablity. But no they had to go for a cheap serial interface... |
#14
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"J. Clarke" wrote in message ... RaceFace wrote: "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. However new high performance motherboards that support AGP are going to be increasingly rare. Intel has dropped AGP support from their new chipsets entirely and nvidia, via, and sis seem to be following their lead. Nvidia's PCI-E board really offers no more extra than PCI-E though. |
#15
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"Nicholas Buenk" wrote in message ... "J. Clarke" wrote in message ... McGrandpa wrote: "RaceFace" wrote in message "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. But more likely, the top end cards will all be PCIx, and mid to low range cards for AGP. PCI-E. Not PCIX, despite nvidia's "PCX" brand name. PCIX is a 64-bit parallel bus that can accept regular PCI boards. It is different from PCI Express. And probably would have been a betters solution, with it's legecy compatablity. But no they had to go for a cheap serial interface... I've just built an Nforce2 system where the graphics card was the only plug in device. I think they thought that for most people the motherboard chipset devices would do the work of any current Plug in cards and all they need new is a PCI-e graphics card. That would have been true if a decent audio solution was in the chipset! For my own new upgrade I went for nforce3 so I could use my old Santa Cruz sound card to replace the soundstorm I was losing. |
#16
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"Nicholas Buenk" wrote in message ... "J. Clarke" wrote in message ... RaceFace wrote: "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. However new high performance motherboards that support AGP are going to be increasingly rare. Intel has dropped AGP support from their new chipsets entirely and nvidia, via, and sis seem to be following their lead. Nvidia's PCI-E board really offers no more extra than PCI-E though. Your right. PCI-e motherboards have to do everything using motherboard chips which users may currently use PCI cards for, as PCI-e cards aren't avaialble. And a significant part of that is "sound". So Nvidia ditch soundstorm, whilst many Intel PCI-e motherboards are appearing with hardware sound chips on the motherboard. I for one wanting PCI-e would consider shifting to Intel completely if I got decent sound. |
#17
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John Russell wrote:
I see PCI Express as more of a "stuck with" than a "must have". I think we would all have been better served if they had instead of PCI Express put PCI-X in their chipsets as a standard feature. But that wouldn't have forced one to upgrade any other components in order to replace a motherboard. It's interesting when the "industry" thinks it in control and control what people buy. Some company "breaks rank" and offers users an alternative. There was Nvidia thinking that Intel users wanting SLI would have to get Nforce5. Now gigabyte have produced SLI on a single card requring a normal PCI-e motherboard, and Intel users can continue to use Intel chipsets and have SLI! I doubt many people could afford to buy a twin card SLI as a complete PC solution, even if the system builders offer it. So for most SLI would be something to progress towards, and gigabyte have offered an alaternative way of doing that! You gotta love the free market system... dvus |
#18
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"dvus" wrote You gotta love the free market system... It would be more fun to get rid of $$ and profit and have democratic production with equal distribution. Then the hardware gurus could really do their thing! -- Ed Light Smiley :-/ MS Smiley :-\ Send spam to the FTC at Thanks, robots. |
#19
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"John Russell" wrote in message ... "Nicholas Buenk" wrote in message ... "J. Clarke" wrote in message ... McGrandpa wrote: "RaceFace" wrote in message "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. But more likely, the top end cards will all be PCIx, and mid to low range cards for AGP. PCI-E. Not PCIX, despite nvidia's "PCX" brand name. PCIX is a 64-bit parallel bus that can accept regular PCI boards. It is different from PCI Express. And probably would have been a betters solution, with it's legecy compatablity. But no they had to go for a cheap serial interface... I've just built an Nforce2 system where the graphics card was the only plug in device. I think they thought that for most people the motherboard chipset devices would do the work of any current Plug in cards and all they need new is a PCI-e graphics card. That would have been true if a decent audio solution was in the chipset! For my own new upgrade I went for nforce3 so I could use my old Santa Cruz sound card to replace the soundstorm I was losing. I will be using a plug in soundcard and a tv card. |
#20
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John Russell wrote:
"Nicholas Buenk" wrote in message ... "J. Clarke" wrote in message ... RaceFace wrote: "YanquiDawg" wrote in message ... Probably a couple more years.There are millions of AGP motherboards out there and they are still being made. Hi all, nVidia, ATI and all other graphics cards, will produce AGP cards for how many time? I agree - it will be at least a year before other cards such as sound cards, network cards, and the like are out in PCIe format in any quantity. It will be that long before there are even any graphics cards that will utilize the potential bandwidth of PCIe, anyway. There'll still be AGP cards around for a while yet. At least a couple years. However new high performance motherboards that support AGP are going to be increasingly rare. Intel has dropped AGP support from their new chipsets entirely and nvidia, via, and sis seem to be following their lead. Nvidia's PCI-E board really offers no more extra than PCI-E though. Your right. PCI-e motherboards have to do everything using motherboard chips which users may currently use PCI cards for, as PCI-e cards aren't avaialble. And a significant part of that is "sound". So Nvidia ditch soundstorm, whilst many Intel PCI-e motherboards are appearing with hardware sound chips on the motherboard. I for one wanting PCI-e would consider shifting to Intel completely if I got decent sound. There are few motherboards that support PCI Express that don't also have ordinary PCI slots. For the most part lack of PCI Express boards is not an issue as yet. -- --John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) |
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