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#11
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Paul wrote:
Mr.E Solved! wrote: The P815 has BNC connectors, which do not use EDID data and thusly install as the default monitor and can have any resolution refresh rate or timing you choose. Have you ever heard of crippling your hardware to be a solution? I found a spec sheet here, and it does list two inputs. 5 x BNC and a VGA connector. So the monitor has two inputs listed. http://web.archive.org/web/199902241...5/P815SPEC.HTM To use BNC, which has no EDID, you'd need a BNC to VGA. My old Trinitron came with such a cable. The cable looks similar to this, with VGA on one end, and five BNC on the other end, for RGBHV. I didn't realize the P815 was that old. http://www.computercableinc.com/ccin...GB-CCStore.jpg Paul Good idea, I forgot about the bnc connectors, I have the cable around here somewhere. All I crippled was an extra adapter plug I wasn't using anyway, and I am satisfied with the results so far. The big regret is the week I burnt up on this. Tech support from evga and nvidia don't seem to have a clue about this problem. The last thing I got from them was they wanted to rma the card. Media player and media center won't play a dvd because of this hack (I think), but I have something else for that. |
#12
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
root wrote:
Paul wrote: Mr.E Solved! wrote: The P815 has BNC connectors, which do not use EDID data and thusly install as the default monitor and can have any resolution refresh rate or timing you choose. Have you ever heard of crippling your hardware to be a solution? I found a spec sheet here, and it does list two inputs. 5 x BNC and a VGA connector. So the monitor has two inputs listed. http://web.archive.org/web/199902241...5/P815SPEC.HTM To use BNC, which has no EDID, you'd need a BNC to VGA. My old Trinitron came with such a cable. The cable looks similar to this, with VGA on one end, and five BNC on the other end, for RGBHV. I didn't realize the P815 was that old. http://www.computercableinc.com/ccin...GB-CCStore.jpg Paul Good idea, I forgot about the bnc connectors, I have the cable around here somewhere. All I crippled was an extra adapter plug I wasn't using anyway, and I am satisfied with the results so far. The big regret is the week I burnt up on this. Tech support from evga and nvidia don't seem to have a clue about this problem. The last thing I got from them was they wanted to rma the card. Media player and media center won't play a dvd because of this hack (I think), but I have something else for that. Are you getting the issue because there has been a hardware 'change' that the DRM is designed to look for and doesn't like? In which case you just go to your DRM folder in Vista and delete everything in there. New copies of the files are then generated for your 'new' hardware. I hope its this simple. |
#13
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Shawk wrote:
root wrote: Paul wrote: Mr.E Solved! wrote: The P815 has BNC connectors, which do not use EDID data and thusly install as the default monitor and can have any resolution refresh rate or timing you choose. Have you ever heard of crippling your hardware to be a solution? I found a spec sheet here, and it does list two inputs. 5 x BNC and a VGA connector. So the monitor has two inputs listed. http://web.archive.org/web/199902241...5/P815SPEC.HTM To use BNC, which has no EDID, you'd need a BNC to VGA. My old Trinitron came with such a cable. The cable looks similar to this, with VGA on one end, and five BNC on the other end, for RGBHV. I didn't realize the P815 was that old. http://www.computercableinc.com/ccin...GB-CCStore.jpg Paul Good idea, I forgot about the bnc connectors, I have the cable around here somewhere. All I crippled was an extra adapter plug I wasn't using anyway, and I am satisfied with the results so far. The big regret is the week I burnt up on this. Tech support from evga and nvidia don't seem to have a clue about this problem. The last thing I got from them was they wanted to rma the card. Media player and media center won't play a dvd because of this hack (I think), but I have something else for that. Are you getting the issue because there has been a hardware 'change' that the DRM is designed to look for and doesn't like? In which case you just go to your DRM folder in Vista and delete everything in there. New copies of the files are then generated for your 'new' hardware. I hope its this simple. Simple? Nonsense, if you have to fight DRM to get your hardware to work, then your OS isn't for you. Anyone who uses Vista this late in the game, with all the facts available as to Vistas weaknesses and strengths deserves their headaches. Vista is designed to thwart you, not aid you...once you get your head wrapped around that concept, you begin to appreciate other user oriented OSes all the more. |
#14
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Mr.E Solved! wrote:
Shawk wrote: root wrote: Paul wrote: Mr.E Solved! wrote: The P815 has BNC connectors, which do not use EDID data and thusly install as the default monitor and can have any resolution refresh rate or timing you choose. Have you ever heard of crippling your hardware to be a solution? I found a spec sheet here, and it does list two inputs. 5 x BNC and a VGA connector. So the monitor has two inputs listed. http://web.archive.org/web/199902241...5/P815SPEC.HTM To use BNC, which has no EDID, you'd need a BNC to VGA. My old Trinitron came with such a cable. The cable looks similar to this, with VGA on one end, and five BNC on the other end, for RGBHV. I didn't realize the P815 was that old. http://www.computercableinc.com/ccin...GB-CCStore.jpg Paul Good idea, I forgot about the bnc connectors, I have the cable around here somewhere. All I crippled was an extra adapter plug I wasn't using anyway, and I am satisfied with the results so far. The big regret is the week I burnt up on this. Tech support from evga and nvidia don't seem to have a clue about this problem. The last thing I got from them was they wanted to rma the card. Media player and media center won't play a dvd because of this hack (I think), but I have something else for that. Are you getting the issue because there has been a hardware 'change' that the DRM is designed to look for and doesn't like? In which case you just go to your DRM folder in Vista and delete everything in there. New copies of the files are then generated for your 'new' hardware. I hope its this simple. Simple? Nonsense, if you have to fight DRM to get your hardware to work, then your OS isn't for you. Anyone who uses Vista this late in the game, with all the facts available as to Vistas weaknesses and strengths deserves their headaches. Vista is designed to thwart you, not aid you...once you get your head wrapped around that concept, you begin to appreciate other user oriented OSes all the more. While I respect your views on a number of subjects your view on Vista is at least one service pack out of date. |
#15
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Mr.E Solved! wrote:
Simple? Nonsense, if you have to fight DRM to get your hardware to work, then your OS isn't for you. If it weren't for my job I'd be over on ubuntu by now. Anyone who uses Vista this late in the game, with all the facts available as to Vistas weaknesses and strengths deserves their headaches. Don't agree. It's still early. Vista is designed to thwart you, not aid you...once you get your head wrapped around that concept, you begin to appreciate other user oriented OSes all the more. I agree. I've read the survey docs on content protection. It's not going to get any better -- microsoft is organizationally retarded. The media player UI is so badly designed I'm shocked any time I open it. The media center UI is also really awful -- extremely uncomfortable navigation, and the channel guide is wrong, incomplete channel info for my area. They are only driving people to the alternatives. VLC and BeyondTV are 2 that I use, and they completely blow away what microsoft has. Microsoft will continue to lock down the content pathways and I don't know how long these programs will work. It's absurd to pay this much for an operating system and not be able to set your resolution or play a dvd right out of the box. I still haven't been able to play a dvd with media player... I never use it on xp so the same will hold for vista. |
#16
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Paul wrote:
root wrote: There seems to be practically ziltch tech documentation for edid and vista. It appears it enforces edid much more than XP ever did, and its not the nvidia driver doing this. Now, moving on to the next screw job, I believe I am finding that my video card, dvd drive, and crt monitor are not acceptable to vista's media player for playing dvds. I get the 'can't play due to drm blah blah blah' error. I found one powerpoint that says edid is 'required' on vista. Perhaps by cutting off edid I will not be able to play dvds with media player. My first test with VLC (which I use all the time on XP) was a bit disappointing since the HDTV image seemed degraded with small distortions that I do not see on XP. I have to run more tests. Honestly, they did a poor job with vista, and I think I entered into this with an open mind 2 weeks ago. At least if something won't work they should have technical support docs that really say something, rather than the few extremely dumbed down support pages they bothered to write. If that is the case, another possibility is - Investigate reprogramming the EDID. This article is a good jumping off point, even if it doesn't have every possible answer. http://www.geocities.com/jgeneedid/ Gefen has a box, that can store a copy of an EDID, then play it back to the computer. The Gefen box, would be used like this. Video_card ---- Gefen ---- Monitor The EDID comes from the Gefen, the video signal goes to the monitor. To program the Gefen, you connect it to some monitor, say a cheap_monitor that has a programmable EDID chip on it. Then push the button on the Gefen, to get it to copy the monitor info, to the EDID chip inside the Gefen. The cheap_monitor is only necessary on the assumption that not all expensive_monitors will support writing the EDID, and the cheap_monitor is an intermediate step to give a degree of programmability. Too bad the Gefen didn't have a local interface that allowed tinkering. (Besides pulling out the EEPROM inside, and replacing it with something.) http://www.gefen.com/pdf/EXT-DVI-EDIDN.pdf http://www.geocities.com/jgeneedid/Inside320.jpg (previous generation picture) I just found this product, and apparently this device has an RS-232 interface for programming. So you can stuff a table of your own making, into this box, and have it played back when the computer attempts to read the EDID. It is a little bit pricey, but considering how many of these they'd sell, I suppose it is worth it. I haven't found a manual for this. http://www.avenview.com/edid-reader-writer-p-560.html At this point, I don't know what I'd write in the EDID, to make Vista like it more. I mean, as soon as Vista realizes a high resolution (higher than the movie industry likes) is "escaping from the computer", then anything could happen. I have confirmed that media player won't play a dvd because of the unidentified analog monitor. Using only the hdtv, it plays ok. So I fix one thing and another thing breaks. Instead of disabling EDID I could spoof it in some way by reprogramming the monitor (?) or using one of these gadgets. I wish the video driver could do this but I think they are contractually obligated to disallow this sort of tinkering. They have to protect the content pathway, but for a dvd it's sort of silly since there are several software programs that can copy a dvd. Even if I could reprogram the EDID to give me more resolution, the presence of an analog VGA pathway may still force overall degradation by their drm software. I don't know until I try it, and VLC is way easier instead. |
#17
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Shawk wrote:
Mr.E Solved! wrote: Shawk wrote: root wrote: Paul wrote: Mr.E Solved! wrote: The P815 has BNC connectors, which do not use EDID data and thusly install as the default monitor and can have any resolution refresh rate or timing you choose. Have you ever heard of crippling your hardware to be a solution? I found a spec sheet here, and it does list two inputs. 5 x BNC and a VGA connector. So the monitor has two inputs listed. http://web.archive.org/web/199902241...5/P815SPEC.HTM To use BNC, which has no EDID, you'd need a BNC to VGA. My old Trinitron came with such a cable. The cable looks similar to this, with VGA on one end, and five BNC on the other end, for RGBHV. I didn't realize the P815 was that old. http://www.computercableinc.com/ccin...GB-CCStore.jpg Paul Good idea, I forgot about the bnc connectors, I have the cable around here somewhere. All I crippled was an extra adapter plug I wasn't using anyway, and I am satisfied with the results so far. The big regret is the week I burnt up on this. Tech support from evga and nvidia don't seem to have a clue about this problem. The last thing I got from them was they wanted to rma the card. Media player and media center won't play a dvd because of this hack (I think), but I have something else for that. Are you getting the issue because there has been a hardware 'change' that the DRM is designed to look for and doesn't like? In which case you just go to your DRM folder in Vista and delete everything in there. New copies of the files are then generated for your 'new' hardware. I hope its this simple. Simple? Nonsense, if you have to fight DRM to get your hardware to work, then your OS isn't for you. Anyone who uses Vista this late in the game, with all the facts available as to Vistas weaknesses and strengths deserves their headaches. Vista is designed to thwart you, not aid you...once you get your head wrapped around that concept, you begin to appreciate other user oriented OSes all the more. While I respect your views on a number of subjects your view on Vista is at least one service pack out of date. Vista's SP1 did nothing for this topic, my points are still topical and the end result is end user disappointment/frustration/disgust/in search of other solutions. Don't be disingenuous, you have zero chance of convincing anyone in this NG of Vista's superiority or even parity to alternative OS solutions, even without the over-arching DRM deal-breaker. |
#18
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
root wrote:
Paul wrote: root wrote: There seems to be practically ziltch tech documentation for edid and vista. It appears it enforces edid much more than XP ever did, and its not the nvidia driver doing this. Now, moving on to the next screw job, I believe I am finding that my video card, dvd drive, and crt monitor are not acceptable to vista's media player for playing dvds. I get the 'can't play due to drm blah blah blah' error. I found one powerpoint that says edid is 'required' on vista. Perhaps by cutting off edid I will not be able to play dvds with media player. My first test with VLC (which I use all the time on XP) was a bit disappointing since the HDTV image seemed degraded with small distortions that I do not see on XP. I have to run more tests. Honestly, they did a poor job with vista, and I think I entered into this with an open mind 2 weeks ago. At least if something won't work they should have technical support docs that really say something, rather than the few extremely dumbed down support pages they bothered to write. If that is the case, another possibility is - Investigate reprogramming the EDID. This article is a good jumping off point, even if it doesn't have every possible answer. http://www.geocities.com/jgeneedid/ Gefen has a box, that can store a copy of an EDID, then play it back to the computer. The Gefen box, would be used like this. Video_card ---- Gefen ---- Monitor The EDID comes from the Gefen, the video signal goes to the monitor. To program the Gefen, you connect it to some monitor, say a cheap_monitor that has a programmable EDID chip on it. Then push the button on the Gefen, to get it to copy the monitor info, to the EDID chip inside the Gefen. The cheap_monitor is only necessary on the assumption that not all expensive_monitors will support writing the EDID, and the cheap_monitor is an intermediate step to give a degree of programmability. Too bad the Gefen didn't have a local interface that allowed tinkering. (Besides pulling out the EEPROM inside, and replacing it with something.) http://www.gefen.com/pdf/EXT-DVI-EDIDN.pdf http://www.geocities.com/jgeneedid/Inside320.jpg (previous generation picture) I just found this product, and apparently this device has an RS-232 interface for programming. So you can stuff a table of your own making, into this box, and have it played back when the computer attempts to read the EDID. It is a little bit pricey, but considering how many of these they'd sell, I suppose it is worth it. I haven't found a manual for this. http://www.avenview.com/edid-reader-writer-p-560.html At this point, I don't know what I'd write in the EDID, to make Vista like it more. I mean, as soon as Vista realizes a high resolution (higher than the movie industry likes) is "escaping from the computer", then anything could happen. I have confirmed that media player won't play a dvd because of the unidentified analog monitor. Using only the hdtv, it plays ok. So I fix one thing and another thing breaks. Instead of disabling EDID I could spoof it in some way by reprogramming the monitor (?) or using one of these gadgets. I wish the video driver could do this but I think they are contractually obligated to disallow this sort of tinkering. They have to protect the content pathway, but for a dvd it's sort of silly since there are several software programs that can copy a dvd. Even if I could reprogram the EDID to give me more resolution, the presence of an analog VGA pathway may still force overall degradation by their drm software. I don't know until I try it, and VLC is way easier instead. Windows DDM is loaded to the gills with DRM and performance crippling device polling. That's right, many times a second the entire signal pathway is checked for 'integrity' needlessly complexifying everything. For what? To make your PC a glorified stand-alone HD-DVD player/ Games for Windows/XBOX console. By the way, if any current nvidia/msft/studio employees are in this thread your paid opinions are noted. Now STFU and GBTW. |
#19
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Mr.E Solved! wrote:
Shawk wrote: Mr.E Solved! wrote: Shawk wrote: root wrote: Paul wrote: Mr.E Solved! wrote: The P815 has BNC connectors, which do not use EDID data and thusly install as the default monitor and can have any resolution refresh rate or timing you choose. Have you ever heard of crippling your hardware to be a solution? I found a spec sheet here, and it does list two inputs. 5 x BNC and a VGA connector. So the monitor has two inputs listed. http://web.archive.org/web/199902241...5/P815SPEC.HTM To use BNC, which has no EDID, you'd need a BNC to VGA. My old Trinitron came with such a cable. The cable looks similar to this, with VGA on one end, and five BNC on the other end, for RGBHV. I didn't realize the P815 was that old. http://www.computercableinc.com/ccin...GB-CCStore.jpg Paul Good idea, I forgot about the bnc connectors, I have the cable around here somewhere. All I crippled was an extra adapter plug I wasn't using anyway, and I am satisfied with the results so far. The big regret is the week I burnt up on this. Tech support from evga and nvidia don't seem to have a clue about this problem. The last thing I got from them was they wanted to rma the card. Media player and media center won't play a dvd because of this hack (I think), but I have something else for that. Are you getting the issue because there has been a hardware 'change' that the DRM is designed to look for and doesn't like? In which case you just go to your DRM folder in Vista and delete everything in there. New copies of the files are then generated for your 'new' hardware. I hope its this simple. Simple? Nonsense, if you have to fight DRM to get your hardware to work, then your OS isn't for you. Anyone who uses Vista this late in the game, with all the facts available as to Vistas weaknesses and strengths deserves their headaches. Vista is designed to thwart you, not aid you...once you get your head wrapped around that concept, you begin to appreciate other user oriented OSes all the more. While I respect your views on a number of subjects your view on Vista is at least one service pack out of date. Vista's SP1 did nothing for this topic, my points are still topical and the end result is end user disappointment/frustration/disgust/in search of other solutions. By your own straw argument your first para was 'topical'. The other two were neither 'topical' nor factual. Don't be disingenuous, you have zero chance of convincing anyone in this NG of Vista's superiority or even parity to alternative OS solutions, even without the over-arching DRM deal-breaker. "Disingenuous - Adjective - lacking in frankness, candor, or sincerity; falsely or hypocritically ingenuous; insincere" I'm none of those but at least you spelled it correctly. Neither am I trying to convince anyone in this ng of anything but how to potentially fix a problem. And I couldn't give a **** whether other people like Vista or not. Unlike you it seems. Feel free to have the last word - it'll probably matter more to you than me. |
#20
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Vista - nvidia - clone mode bug
Mr.E Solved! wrote:
By the way, if any current nvidia/msft/studio employees are in this thread your paid opinions are noted. Now STFU and GBTW. Lol, I mend trucks so I know you don't mean me... |
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