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Differences between Thunderbird, Palomino, Barton ?



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 18th 03, 02:29 PM
liaM
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Default Differences between Thunderbird, Palomino, Barton ?



It seems possible to purchase Atlon XPs at equal PR ratings
yet different types......

What's different about them, say for a processor with a rating
of 1800 ?

Oh yes.. what does the + sign after the 18OO signify ? What are
series 6 or 8 athlons ?




Thanks ..
liaM
  #2  
Old September 18th 03, 03:02 PM
rstlne
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"liaM" wrote in message
...


It seems possible to purchase Atlon XPs at equal PR ratings
yet different types......

What's different about them, say for a processor with a rating
of 1800 ?

Oh yes.. what does the + sign after the 18OO signify ? What are
series 6 or 8 athlons ?




Thanks ..
liaM


I would think that the + means it's a PR rating



OPN Code Frequency
1000 1000MHz
1100 1100MHz
1133 1133MHz
1200 1200MHz
1300 1300MHz
1333 1333MHz
1400 1400MHz (desktop)
1400 1200MHz (Mobile)
1500 1333MHz
1600 1400MHz
1700 1467MHz
1800 1533MHz
1900 1600MHz
2000 1667MHz
2100 1733MHz
2200 1800MHz
2400 2000MHz
2500 1833MHz
2600 2083MHz (333FSB)
2600 2133MHz (266FSB)
2700 2167MHz
2800 2083MHz
3000 2167MHz


  #3  
Old September 18th 03, 04:07 PM
liaM
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What is the FSB for a 2500 OPN ?
Or are there various FSBs for it (like for the 2600).

Also.. what is the max FSB for a 1800+ unit ???
And, again.. what's different between a Thubderbird, Palomino, Barton ??

thanks
liaM





I would think that the + means it's a PR rating

OPN Code Frequency
1000 1000MHz
1100 1100MHz
1133 1133MHz
1200 1200MHz
1300 1300MHz
1333 1333MHz
1400 1400MHz (desktop)
1400 1200MHz (Mobile)
1500 1333MHz
1600 1400MHz
1700 1467MHz
1800 1533MHz
1900 1600MHz
2000 1667MHz
2100 1733MHz
2200 1800MHz
2400 2000MHz
2500 1833MHz
2600 2083MHz (333FSB)
2600 2133MHz (266FSB)
2700 2167MHz
2800 2083MHz
3000 2167MHz

  #4  
Old September 18th 03, 05:27 PM
lost
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liaM wrote:

What is the FSB for a 2500 OPN ?


166/333MHz

Or are there various FSBs for it (like for the 2600).


No, the Barton only by default works with 166/333MHz FSB (except the 3200+
which goes with the 200/400MHZ FSB).

Also.. what is the max FSB for a 1800+ unit ???
And, again.. what's different between a Thubderbird, Palomino, Barton ??


The Thunderbird was the 2nd K7 core. The fastest one is 1400MHz. They all
ran with a 100/200FSB except a few of the last ones which ran with the newer
133/266FSB.
The Palomino was the original AthlonXP core. They produced far more heat,
had a more primitive production process, and couldn't run as fast as the
newer cores. You can't readily buy them anymore.
The Thoroughbred was the next AthlonXP core. It ran much cooler, so it could
go faster. Most work with 133/266MHz FSB, but some of the faster ones are
available for 166/333MHz FSB. The Thoroughbred B uses slightly less
electricity & runs cooler.
The Barton is basically a Thoroughbred B with additional cache on the chip
to make it go faster. As AMD couldn't make the core run reliabily faster
than ~2.25GHz, they instead tried to match Intel's top performers by adding
cache ram. A Barton XP 2500+ is considered a good chip to overclock - it is
the best value for money so long as your motherboard can handle it without
fuss.

The + sign indicates a PR rating instead of a MHz rating. An Athlon XP 2200+
for example runs as fast as a Thunderbird would if it could run at 2200MHz,
athough it is only 1,800MHz. The PR ratings have been a marketing disaster
for AMD, as people assume they mean in relation to the Pentium, when infact
a XP 2200+ is faster than a 2.2GHz P4.

The "for such and such FSB" of each CPU indicates what FSB speed the CPU's
clock speed multiplier is set with in mind. You can manually set the CPU's
multiplier, and therefore run it at the correct speed with almost any FSB
speed, but the process is usually far more involved than you'll ever want to
know.



  #5  
Old September 18th 03, 05:28 PM
E_\\_¼__½__¾__F
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1500+ - 2400+ = 266fsb
2500+ - 2800+ = 333fsb altho the 2600+ was put out in both 266 and
333
3000+ - 3400+ = both 333 and 400fsb availability.

Not too sure about differences in detail. Palomino was an update from
the thunderbird/morgan cores, Tbred A was an update from the Palo.
Tbred B from A... Barton from Tbred etc. The main diff between the
barton and tbreds and below is the cache. tbreds and below have 384k
total cache and bartons have 512k total. Durons I think had 256k
total (128k L1 and 128k L2, someone correct me if I'm wrong) hope
this helps some...

"liaM" wrote in message
...
|
|
| It seems possible to purchase Atlon XPs at equal PR ratings
| yet different types......
|
| What's different about them, say for a processor with a rating
| of 1800 ?
|
| Oh yes.. what does the + sign after the 18OO signify ? What are
| series 6 or 8 athlons ?
|
|
|
|
| Thanks ..
| liaM


  #6  
Old September 18th 03, 07:37 PM
liaM
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Posts: n/a
Default




Thanks.. I'm not so lost as I was before your explanation !!
But how do you do it, lost as your are ?



liaM

PS. for sure the 2500 is a great chip, then. I've been running it
reliably and cool at 380 FSB and 56=B0C..
  #7  
Old September 18th 03, 07:45 PM
liaM
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Posts: n/a
Default


All this is very interesting.. Before posting here, I went to the =

AMD site thinking there'd be a straightforward explanation of the
different models. No such luck (except for reading 100+ page PDF
manuals..). Check out "lost"'s reply to my post. It's
really interesting how AMD shot itself in the foot with PR ratings,
increasing cache size on the Barton just to play catch-up..


Thanks,
liaM









"E_\\_=BC__=BD__=BE__F" a =E9crit :
=


1500+ - 2400+ =3D 266fsb
2500+ - 2800+ =3D 333fsb altho the 2600+ was put out in both 266 and
333
3000+ - 3400+ =3D both 333 and 400fsb availability.
=


Not too sure about differences in detail. Palomino was an update from
the thunderbird/morgan cores, Tbred A was an update from the Palo.
Tbred B from A... Barton from Tbred etc. The main diff between the
barton and tbreds and below is the cache. tbreds and below have 384k
total cache and bartons have 512k total. Durons I think had 256k
total (128k L1 and 128k L2, someone correct me if I'm wrong) hope
this helps some...

  #8  
Old September 18th 03, 08:32 PM
mcheu
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On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 17:07:41 +0200, liaM wrote::

What is the FSB for a 2500 OPN ?
Or are there various FSBs for it (like for the 2600).

Also.. what is the max FSB for a 1800+ unit ???
And, again.. what's different between a Thubderbird, Palomino, Barton ??

thanks
liaM





The 2600+ doesn't have a varying FSB. From what I understand, there
are two versions of it that are sold as XP2600+. An earlier 133/266
FSB version (Palomino), and a later production version which is a
166/333 part (Barton).

What's the max FSB for an 1800+ unit? Can't answer that. The
standard FSB for it is 133, with the memory going at 266 (as it's
DDR). If you plan on overclocking, you're going into unknown
territory, as the proc isn't meant to go at that speed, and your
personal results may vary from chip to chip.

(These are incomplete. If you want full details, go to www.amd.com
and read the technical papers).

Thunderbird - This was a revision to the original K7 Athlon, which
was designed to be equivalent to a Intel P2 or P3. MMX/3DNow
instructions. One of the big deal improvements was a core shrink,
which allowed lower power consumption, and higher speeds.

AthlonXP/Palomino - AthlonXP chips 1800+ to 2500+ are for sure
Palominos. Improved cache, better power consumption, and
incorporation of the Intel SSE instructions (called 3DNow Enhanced by
AMD). They also started using the PR rating at this point. Also,
FSB was ramped up to 133, with memory going at 266, as AMD had
standardized on DDR memory.

AthlonXP/Barton - The newer XP chips. Smaller core, faster speeds,
and improved cache. Also, a higher FSB -- 166, with memory going at
333. Don't really know much more about the Bartons.

The only real confusion point is the XP2600+, which early in
production was a Palomino (the 133MHz FSB version) and the more recent
ones are Barton core (166/333). The only way to tell which version
you have is to look at the chip (and there, you'd actually have to
know what to look for). The retail packaging is identical, so the
casual buyer won't be able to tell at a glance. The reason why it's
important to know which version is that some motherboards which claim
to support the 2600+ only support the Palomino (133/266) version, and
might not work with the Barton one.

The PR being a performance rating vs how the chip performed compared
to an original K7 Athlon (or Pentium 2/3). The + is just marketspeak
for "for some stuff, it might perform better than that".

Again, I'm certain that I've left out a lot of stuff, as I'm not an
expert on AMD CPUs. If you really want to know all the differences,
read the white papers on AMD's site - www.amd.com. If you just want
more detail, read the articles on hardware sites like tomshardware
(www.tomshardware.com)


----------------------------------------
Thanks,

MCheu
  #9  
Old September 18th 03, 08:43 PM
E_\\_¼__½__¾__F
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Posts: n/a
Default

Not entirely true... I have the 2600+/266 CPU which is a Thoroughbred
B Core. To my knowledge, there were no palomino cores made above the
2100+.


"mcheu" wrote in message
...
| On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 17:07:41 +0200, liaM wrote::
|
| What is the FSB for a 2500 OPN ?
| Or are there various FSBs for it (like for the 2600).
|
| Also.. what is the max FSB for a 1800+ unit ???
| And, again.. what's different between a Thubderbird, Palomino,
Barton ??
|
| thanks
| liaM
|
|
|
|
|
| The 2600+ doesn't have a varying FSB. From what I understand,
there
| are two versions of it that are sold as XP2600+. An earlier
133/266
| FSB version (Palomino), and a later production version which is a
| 166/333 part (Barton).
|


  #10  
Old September 18th 03, 08:45 PM
E_\\_¼__½__¾__F
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Posts: n/a
Default

And the Barton was 2500+, 2800+ and up. there were no Barton 2600+,
2700+ chips.

"E_\_¼__½__¾__F" wrote in message
m...
| Not entirely true... I have the 2600+/266 CPU which is a
Thoroughbred
| B Core. To my knowledge, there were no palomino cores made above
the
| 2100+.
|
|
| "mcheu" wrote in message
| ...
| | On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 17:07:41 +0200, liaM
wrote::
| |
| | What is the FSB for a 2500 OPN ?
| | Or are there various FSBs for it (like for the 2600).
| |
| | Also.. what is the max FSB for a 1800+ unit ???
| | And, again.. what's different between a Thubderbird, Palomino,
| Barton ??
| |
| | thanks
| | liaM
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| | The 2600+ doesn't have a varying FSB. From what I understand,
| there
| | are two versions of it that are sold as XP2600+. An earlier
| 133/266
| | FSB version (Palomino), and a later production version which is a
| | 166/333 part (Barton).
| |
|
|


 




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