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#11
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 at 19:03:49, micky wrote
(my responses usually follow points raised): [] First answer is: As far as I know, the voltage of the board in the bios shows the max voltage that can be drawn by the hardware, so if the RAM only draws 1.35, that's all it should use. I'm not 100% though so this is purely a comment, not an answer. You don't "draw" voltage, you draw current. Voltage is supplied. That's for sure, it's not an answer, because his first sentence shows he doesn't know how electricity works. bg (-: [] -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf "My dear doctor, they're all true." "Including the lies?" "_Especially_ the lies." - Deep Space Nine |
#12
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 27 Jan 2021 22:01:38 -0500, "David W.
Hodgins" wrote: On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 20:34:59 -0500, micky wrote: In alt.comp.hardware, on Tue, 26 Jan 2021 18:39:53 -0500, "David W. Hodgins" wrote: https://www.memory4less.com/hp-8gb-ddr3-pc12800-bu37aa shows it's available at $68.40 each. This is it, but it's not exactly the same as the Samsung that's in there now. Which is more important? :-( Well, you know that what's in there works. The above should work based on the specs, and I'd be surprised if it didn't. Your choice though. :-) My choice? I don't know. I left it up to you guys, pretty much, and your answer is pretty convincing. LOL, yes it's my choice and I'm happy with your answer, and the others. Thanks. I ordered the matching dimms. Regards, Dave Hodgins |
#13
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:33:08 -0500, Paul
wrote: micky wrote: In alt.comp.hardware, on Tue, 26 Jan 2021 19:22:59 -0500, Paul wrote: micky wrote: I wanted to get more RAM for my newly-acquired PC Entering the make and model, HP EliteDesk 800 G1 Small Form Factor Crucial suggests only CT2K102464BD160B DDR3 PC3-12800 • CL=11 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR3-1600 • 1.35V • 1024Meg x 64 • $76 even cheaper at NewEgg, Kingston suggests only KCP316ND8/8 Specs: DDR3, 1600MHz, Non-ECC, CL11, X8, 1.5V, Unbuffered, DIMM, 240-pin, 2R, 4Gbit $98 The items are in different order but the main difference seems to me to be 1.35v vs 1.5v. That seems important, right? How can they be different for the same computer? (I'm not really concerned about price unless they could sell it cheaper by making it at the wrong, lower voltage. ) Do I need to look up what the computer puts out? Would one of these be overclocked if the computer puts out 1.5v and the other underclocked if the computer puts out 1.35? I already have 2 sticks, Do I want to get the same voltage that they use, whatever that is? ------ Other differences are Crucial says PC3-12800 but Kingston doesn't include that. Kingston says X8, 2R, 4Gbit but Crucial doesn't include any of that. Does any of that matter? ------ FTR, I only looked at Newegg because Crucial was out of stock. NewEgg says "Ships from China. Newegg Most customers receive within 10-32 days." Hmm. At https://www.newegg.com/crucial-16gb-...82E16820156047 it says sold and shipped by Ram-Store and when you click on 12 New from $88.46 , it goes to the bottom of the page where they have 12 vendors selling the same thing. Just like Amazon does it. I only looked at the first 5 but one is in Hong Kong and "Most customers receive within 4-17 days.". One is in the US and "Most customers receive within 7-9 days", all except Hong Kong for the same price!! (For Hong Kong and the next 7 the price gets higher.) But this doesn't matter until I understand the voltage question. 1.35V DIMMs run in a 1.5V motherboard. There should be a FAQ with the details around somewhere. https://superuser.com/questions/5641...y-or-overclock First answer is: As far as I know, the voltage of the board in the bios shows the max voltage that can be drawn by the hardware, so if the RAM only draws 1.35, that's all it should use. I'm not 100% though so this is purely a comment, not an answer. If your machine uses SODIMMs, I must have selected the wrong item from the Crucial list. No, it doesn't us SODIMMs. The two smaller versions of the same name do, but the my SFF and the tower version use dimms. If you have part numbers on the existing modules and you're happy with them, then that's likely just as good of a choice as anything else. If you got "fancy" products with low CAS, they wouldn't help, because the slowest memory in the machine determine the speed choice made by the BIOS. Okay, so there's no point in looking for lower CAS. Someone suggested buying 4 8's but I don't want to spend extra money. (The first machine I bought, the one that didnt' work and was the wrong model too, had all 4 slots filled with 4's, and I thought that might be the standard in refurbishing, but this one has 2 8's .) But if supplies were limited (like the Crucial being out of stock), I was looking around to see what could be fitted from the existing pool of product. I'm really surprised you can find branded Samsung DIMMs/SODIMMs. Samsung sells product more to businesses than to end users. If I'd known that, I might not have looked! Several places that google found were out of stock, but as is not uncommon, Amazon had it, although its sold and shipped by Dataram, a company that's 54 years old and made ram themselves, and I think they still do. And it's even in New Jersey so maybe I'll get it a day or two earlier since I'm in Baltimore. (though it says 14 days. That's okay.) So I got the Samsung from them via Amazon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dataram although the info on this page stops at about 2011. http://memory.dataram.com/ Their webpage is in English, French, German, and Japanese! The SPD table shows what the DIMM expects in terms of voltage. The SPD chip receives power right away, and the BIOS reads the SPD. The BIOS "turns on" the VDIMM regulator, only when it has determined what the strategy is. So RAM is "commissioned" This is all very clever. by the BIOS POST process - and some of the BIOS code runs without RAM for storage, and variables are stored in CPU internal registers. If the BIOS is unhappy with what it reads in the SPD table, it will "beep". And occasionally a poster will post a question about a BIOS that is beeping, when it should not. And in some cases, it tries to match fields in the SPD that are "don't cares". That means poorly prepared SPD table contents, can result in surprises for users. One DIMM even had the wrong SPD chip soldered to it :-) Clever. LOL Thanks. Paul |
#14
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
On 1/27/21 4:06 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.comp.hardware, on Tue, 26 Jan 2021 16:03:52 -0800, T wrote: On 1/26/21 1:56 PM, micky wrote: I wanted to get more RAM for my newly-acquired PC Entering the make and model, HP EliteDesk 800 G1 Small Form Factor Crucial suggests only CT2K102464BD160B DDR3 PC3-12800 • CL=11 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR3-1600 • 1.35V • 1024Meg x 64 • $76 even cheaper at NewEgg, Kingston suggests only KCP316ND8/8 Specs: DDR3, 1600MHz, Non-ECC, CL11, X8, 1.5V, Unbuffered, DIMM, 240-pin, 2R, 4Gbit $98 The items are in different order but the main difference seems to me to be 1.35v vs 1.5v. That seems important, right? How can they be different for the same computer? (I'm not really concerned about price unless they could sell it cheaper by making it at the wrong, lower voltage. ) Do I need to look up what the computer puts out? Would one of these be overclocked if the computer puts out 1.5v and the other underclocked if the computer puts out 1.35? I already have 2 sticks, Do I want to get the same voltage that they use, whatever that is? ------ Other differences are Crucial says PC3-12800 but Kingston doesn't include that. Kingston says X8, 2R, 4Gbit but Crucial doesn't include any of that. Does any of that matter? ------ FTR, I only looked at Newegg because Crucial was out of stock. NewEgg says "Ships from China. Newegg Most customers receive within 10-32 days." Hmm. At https://www.newegg.com/crucial-16gb-...82E16820156047 it says sold and shipped by Ram-Store and when you click on 12 New from $88.46 , it goes to the bottom of the page where they have 12 vendors selling the same thing. Just like Amazon does it. I only looked at the first 5 but one is in Hong Kong and "Most customers receive within 4-17 days.". One is in the US and "Most customers receive within 7-9 days", all except Hong Kong for the same price!! (For Hong Kong and the next 7 the price gets higher.) But this doesn't matter until I understand the voltage question. Hi Micky, Call Kingston tech support and describe the issue to them: 877-546-4786 714-435-2600 Kingston's customer service is something to behold. Because of it. I only sell their memory, unless they don't carry what I need. They really, really back their stuff up. -T Thanks. I almost did this but then saw that I had Samsung in there now. So unless someone tells me I shouldn't, matching the dimms that are there now is the right thing to do? SAMSUNG M378B1G73DB0-CK0 My experience is that you should match them |
#15
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
T wrote:
On 1/27/21 4:06 PM, micky wrote: In alt.comp.hardware, on Tue, 26 Jan 2021 16:03:52 -0800, T wrote: On 1/26/21 1:56 PM, micky wrote: I wanted to get more RAM for my newly-acquired PC Entering the make and model, HP EliteDesk 800 G1 Small Form Factor Crucial suggests only CT2K102464BD160B DDR3 PC3-12800 • CL=11 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR3-1600 • 1.35V • 1024Meg x 64 • $76 even cheaper at NewEgg, Kingston suggests only KCP316ND8/8 Specs: DDR3, 1600MHz, Non-ECC, CL11, X8, 1.5V, Unbuffered, DIMM, 240-pin, 2R, 4Gbit $98 The items are in different order but the main difference seems to me to be 1.35v vs 1.5v. That seems important, right? How can they be different for the same computer? (I'm not really concerned about price unless they could sell it cheaper by making it at the wrong, lower voltage. ) Do I need to look up what the computer puts out? Would one of these be overclocked if the computer puts out 1.5v and the other underclocked if the computer puts out 1.35? I already have 2 sticks, Do I want to get the same voltage that they use, whatever that is? ------ Other differences are Crucial says PC3-12800 but Kingston doesn't include that. Kingston says X8, 2R, 4Gbit but Crucial doesn't include any of that. Does any of that matter? ------ FTR, I only looked at Newegg because Crucial was out of stock. NewEgg says "Ships from China. Newegg Most customers receive within 10-32 days." Hmm. At https://www.newegg.com/crucial-16gb-...82E16820156047 it says sold and shipped by Ram-Store and when you click on 12 New from $88.46 , it goes to the bottom of the page where they have 12 vendors selling the same thing. Just like Amazon does it. I only looked at the first 5 but one is in Hong Kong and "Most customers receive within 4-17 days.". One is in the US and "Most customers receive within 7-9 days", all except Hong Kong for the same price!! (For Hong Kong and the next 7 the price gets higher.) But this doesn't matter until I understand the voltage question. Hi Micky, Call Kingston tech support and describe the issue to them: 877-546-4786 714-435-2600 Kingston's customer service is something to behold. Because of it. I only sell their memory, unless they don't carry what I need. They really, really back their stuff up. -T Thanks. I almost did this but then saw that I had Samsung in there now. So unless someone tells me I shouldn't, matching the dimms that are there now is the right thing to do? SAMSUNG M378B1G73DB0-CK0 My experience is that you should match them You know there are more nuances than that. If Dell sells a 6GB machine, you know right away it shipped with a 4GB and a 2GB module, and it left the factory in an unmatched state. The machines are obviously flexible to some degree, as these non-power-of-two machines are quite common at retail. I try not to send people on excessively constrained missions, if I can help it. FLEX memory capability has probably been around now for ten years, and lots of machines can accept, say, 512MB,1GB,2GB,4GB in the four slots and still work. Is it "optimal" ? Of course not. But for the average user seeking an easy upgrade with garbage in the desk drawer, it'll work. And the Intel caching structure makes any reduction in memory speed, almost invisible to these choices. (older AMD, less so) It's better for the user, if they have a "retail" motherboard in a home-built machine, as those have extensive controls (even if I don't know what to do with all the settings!). It's the Dell and HP machines, you have to use your intuition as to what aspects of memory choices will antagonize the BIOS, or not. "Strict matching" is a good rule for say, S939. Paul |
#16
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:47:51 -0500, micky
wrote: If I'd known that, I might not have looked! Several places that google found were out of stock, but as is not uncommon, Amazon had it, although its sold and shipped by Dataram, a company that's 54 years old and made ram themselves, and I think they still do. And it's even in New Jersey so maybe I'll get it a day or two earlier since I'm in Baltimore. (though it says 14 days. That's okay.) Things usually come when Amazon says they will or 1-3 days earlier, but this time the webpage said 11-14 days. But... Bought it late Wednesday night, shipped on Thursday from Princeton, New Jersey, USPS Via Philadephia, in Baltimore today, Friday, since 8AM, Probably get it tomorrow. 2 days instead of 11-14. I'm glad I didnt' pay extra for faster shipping. |
#17
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
micky wrote:
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:47:51 -0500, micky wrote: If I'd known that, I might not have looked! Several places that google found were out of stock, but as is not uncommon, Amazon had it, although its sold and shipped by Dataram, a company that's 54 years old and made ram themselves, and I think they still do. And it's even in New Jersey so maybe I'll get it a day or two earlier since I'm in Baltimore. (though it says 14 days. That's okay.) Things usually come when Amazon says they will or 1-3 days earlier, but this time the webpage said 11-14 days. But... Bought it late Wednesday night, shipped on Thursday from Princeton, New Jersey, USPS Via Philadephia, in Baltimore today, Friday, since 8AM, Probably get it tomorrow. 2 days instead of 11-14. I'm glad I didnt' pay extra for faster shipping. And I thought they were overloaded with stuff to ship ? Paul |
#18
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 29 Jan 2021 04:35:05 -0500, Paul
wrote: T wrote: On 1/27/21 4:06 PM, micky wrote: In alt.comp.hardware, on Tue, 26 Jan 2021 16:03:52 -0800, T wrote: On 1/26/21 1:56 PM, micky wrote: I wanted to get more RAM for my newly-acquired PC Entering the make and model, HP EliteDesk 800 G1 Small Form Factor Crucial suggests only CT2K102464BD160B DDR3 PC3-12800 • CL=11 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR3-1600 • 1.35V • 1024Meg x 64 • $76 even cheaper at NewEgg, Kingston suggests only KCP316ND8/8 Specs: DDR3, 1600MHz, Non-ECC, CL11, X8, 1.5V, Unbuffered, DIMM, 240-pin, 2R, 4Gbit $98 The items are in different order but the main difference seems to me to be 1.35v vs 1.5v. That seems important, right? How can they be different for the same computer? (I'm not really concerned about price unless they could sell it cheaper by making it at the wrong, lower voltage. ) Do I need to look up what the computer puts out? Would one of these be overclocked if the computer puts out 1.5v and the other underclocked if the computer puts out 1.35? I already have 2 sticks, Do I want to get the same voltage that they use, whatever that is? ------ Other differences are Crucial says PC3-12800 but Kingston doesn't include that. Kingston says X8, 2R, 4Gbit but Crucial doesn't include any of that. Does any of that matter? ------ FTR, I only looked at Newegg because Crucial was out of stock. NewEgg says "Ships from China. Newegg Most customers receive within 10-32 days." Hmm. At https://www.newegg.com/crucial-16gb-...82E16820156047 it says sold and shipped by Ram-Store and when you click on 12 New from $88.46 , it goes to the bottom of the page where they have 12 vendors selling the same thing. Just like Amazon does it. I only looked at the first 5 but one is in Hong Kong and "Most customers receive within 4-17 days.". One is in the US and "Most customers receive within 7-9 days", all except Hong Kong for the same price!! (For Hong Kong and the next 7 the price gets higher.) But this doesn't matter until I understand the voltage question. Hi Micky, Call Kingston tech support and describe the issue to them: 877-546-4786 714-435-2600 Kingston's customer service is something to behold. Because of it. I only sell their memory, unless they don't carry what I need. They really, really back their stuff up. -T Thanks. I almost did this but then saw that I had Samsung in there now. So unless someone tells me I shouldn't, matching the dimms that are there now is the right thing to do? SAMSUNG M378B1G73DB0-CK0 My experience is that you should match them Good. That settles it. You know there are more nuances than that. Well, I thought it did. If Dell sells a 6GB machine, you know right away it shipped with a 4GB and a 2GB module, and it left the factory in an unmatched state. The machines are obviously flexible to some degree, as these non-power-of-two machines are quite common at retail. I try not to send people on excessively constrained missions, if I can help it. FLEX memory capability has probably been around now for ten years, and lots of machines can accept, say, 512MB,1GB,2GB,4GB in the four slots and still work. Is it "optimal" ? Of course not. But for the average user seeking an easy upgrade with garbage in the desk drawer, it'll work. And the Intel caching structure makes any reduction in memory speed, almost invisible to these choices. (older AMD, less so) It's better for the user, if they have a "retail" motherboard in a home-built machine, as those have extensive controls (even if I don't know what to do with all the settings!). It's the Dell and HP machines, you have to use your intuition as to what aspects of memory choices will antagonize the BIOS, or not. Nuances beyond my ken, but I can tell you didn't say no. "Strict matching" is a good rule for say, S939. Aha, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_939 Very interesting. Paul |
#19
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 29 Jan 2021 12:47:24 -0500, Paul
wrote: micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:47:51 -0500, micky wrote: If I'd known that, I might not have looked! Several places that google found were out of stock, but as is not uncommon, Amazon had it, although its sold and shipped by Dataram, a company that's 54 years old and made ram themselves, and I think they still do. And it's even in New Jersey so maybe I'll get it a day or two earlier since I'm in Baltimore. (though it says 14 days. That's okay.) Things usually come when Amazon says they will or 1-3 days earlier, but this time the webpage said 11-14 days. But... Bought it late Wednesday night, shipped on Thursday from Princeton, New Jersey, USPS Via Philadephia, in Baltimore today, Friday, since 8AM, Probably get it tomorrow. 2 days instead of 11-14. I'm glad I didnt' pay extra for faster shipping. And I thought they were overloaded with stuff to ship ? Paul I don't know anything for a fact about that, but I think I get less mail than I used to, and my front door is 30-40 feet from the path the mailman would take if he didn't go to my house, times 2 to return. And I think they've stopped delivering my mail until several pieces build up. Worse than that I get a weekly newspaper in the mail and it came either on Friday or Saturday for years, Now they come out of order and always late, a week I got two on the same day, and yesterday I got an issue from December, and that's not unusually late. Plus I never got my emission inspections letter. The email about it came in December, and to get excused because I dont' drive more than 5000 miles a year and I'm over 70, I have to file a form. But the email didn't include the form. The letter would have. It did 2 years ago. And the web didn't have a copy either. So I wrote them a letter explaining all this in the top 1/4 of the page and the rest I copied the format of a different form, with changes to be the form I needed, asking for them to accept that or send me the form. I sent that quite a while ago and haven't heard back, and last time after I sent the form I heard back in less than 2 weeks. The virus might have a lot to do with this last thing. |
#20
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RAN 1.35v vs 1.5v
On 2021-01-29 11:47 a.m., Paul wrote:
micky wrote: In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:47:51 -0500, micky wrote: If I'd known that, I might not have looked!Â*Â*Â* Several places that google found were out of stock, but as is not uncommon, Amazon had it, although its sold and shipped by Dataram, a company that's 54 years old and made ram themselves, and I think they still do.Â*Â* And it's even in New Jersey so maybe I'll get it a day or two earlier since I'm in Baltimore. (though it says 14 days.Â* That's okay.) Things usually come when Amazon says they will or 1-3 days earlier, but this time the webpage said 11-14 days.Â* But... Bought it late Wednesday night, shipped on Thursday from Princeton, New Jersey, USPS Via Philadephia, in Baltimore today, Friday, since 8AM, Probably get it tomorrow. 2 days instead of 11-14. I'm glad I didnt' pay extra for faster shipping. And I thought they were overloaded with stuff to ship ? Â*Â* Paul Apparently they are, but they say they are hiring another 100,000 People in the US and Canada, this was in December 2020. I ordered a new sound bar for my Sons TV last week and got it 2 days later. Rene |
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