Best External Hdd

dvw wrote:

Citizen Bob, could you elaborate on what you mean by "changing the signature" when you use Acronis
True Image Server to make full disk images?

He's actually talking about cloning, not images in the sense that
TI uses the term. There are real downsides with using cloning
for backup, particularly its much too easy to clone backwards
and overwrite what you are trying to backup.

Makes a lot more sense to create images instead, and incremental
images too for the much better speed, and being able to keep more
than just the latest copy of the original too. Then there can never be
a signature problem too.


Citizen Bob wrote
Pat Horridge wrote

I use Seagate external drives and find them to be great.
get one with a high spin speed 7,200 rpm.
I use some small 160GB pocket size drives and they backup 70 GBs in
a few

Use Acronis True Image to do the clone. Much faster and you have a
sector-for-sector copy. Just remember to change the signature or
Windows can screw up. I use Win98SE fdisk /mbr because it has a bug
which overwrites the first 4 bytes of the signature with zeros. That
forces Windows to create a new installation which prevents any
conflicts with the original disk signature. If you don't do that you
are in for a world of pain since Windows is trying to detect pirated
clones and botches it with legitimate ones.

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 16:14:25 +0100, "Pat Horridge"
wrote:

Yes I use Acronis and it's great.

I wonder if it will clone an NTFS partition to a FAT32 partition for a
boot drive.


--

"Nothing in the world can take the place of perseverence. Talent
will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education
will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and
determination alone are omnipotent."
--Calvin Coolidge

On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 06:50:59 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote:

There are real downsides with using cloning
for backup, particularly its much too easy to clone backwards
and overwrite what you are trying to backup.

Not if you put a physical label on the disks.

I use removable trays and have physical labels on the trays so I know
what is what. I make sure beforehand by checking the labels right
before I clone. I have been doing this on the basis of a couple times
per week for over a year now and never once have I even come close to
screwing up.

The method I use is to label each disk with a letter of the alphabet
and invoke the simple protocol that A steps on B, B steps on C and C
steps on A. I keep the disks in a precise order which acts as a second
layer of protection.

I always have the source disk in the boot tray, so I know it is the
source of the clone. The worst that happens is I step on the last disk
instead of the second last. That's why I have 3 disks.

Using a system like this it is NOT "much too easy to clone backwards
and overwrite what you are trying to backup." However for people who
do not know what they are doing, I can see the possibility. But then
they should not be cloning in the first place.





--

"Nothing in the world can take the place of perseverence. Talent
will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education
will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and
determination alone are omnipotent."
--Calvin Coolidge

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 12:15:57 -0400, "dvw"
wrote:

Citizen Bob, could you elaborate on what you mean by "changing the
signature" when you use Acronis True Image Server to make full disk images?

Each partition has a unique "signature" which Windows uses to mount
the device driver for that disk. That saves having to set up the
driver each time. It also prevents cloning because Windows will BSOD
if there are two disks with identical signatures.

Win98SE has a bug in FDISK /MBR which overwrites the first 4 bytes of
the signature. That forces Windows to abandon previous drivers and
create a new one. It creates a new signature and a driver to go along
with it.

Even though you will not mount the old and the new disks at the same
time, the new one is NOT identical to the old one even though it is a
clone. Therefore it can get corrupted if it uses the driver from the
old drive. So I always zero out the signature when I do a hardcopy
clone.


--

"Nothing in the world can take the place of perseverence. Talent
will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education
will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and
determination alone are omnipotent."
--Calvin Coolidge

Citizen Bob wrote
Pat Horridge wrote

Yes I use Acronis and it's great.

I wonder if it will clone an NTFS partition
to a FAT32 partition for a boot drive.

No, but their Disk Director Suite will.

Citizen Bob wrote
Rod Speed wrote

There are real downsides with using cloning for backup,
particularly its much too easy to clone backwards
and overwrite what you are trying to backup.

Not if you put a physical label on the disks.

Not even possible to see that with most systems.

I use removable trays and have physical labels on the trays
so I know what is what. I make sure beforehand by checking
the labels right before I clone. I have been doing this on the
basis of a couple times per week for over a year now and
never once have I even come close to screwing up.

Not even possible to see that label with most systems.

The method I use is to label each disk with a letter of the
alphabet and invoke the simple protocol that A steps on B,
B steps on C and C steps on A. I keep the disks in a precise
order which acts as a second layer of protection.

Makes a lot more sense to use a decent modern incremental
imager and have it look after all that stuff auto and completely
eliminate any possibility of cloning backwards.

MUCH faster too.

I always have the source disk in the boot tray, so I know it is the
source of the clone. The worst that happens is I step on the last
disk instead of the second last. That's why I have 3 disks.

Using a system like this it is NOT "much too easy to clone
backwards and overwrite what you are trying to backup."

Fraid so when you dont have the drives in removable bays and
prefer to have the backup drive in another PC across the lan etc.

However for people who do not know what they
are doing, I can see the possibility. But then
they should not be cloning in the first place.

Neither should you, you should be using a decent modern incremental
imager instead so you get the backup done much more quickly as a
bonus and you dont have to fart around with removable drives either.

Once you bin the removable drive bays, the backup can be completely
automated and you dont have to wait around for it to happen either.
Just check that the automated backup did work properly after the event.

Citizen Bob wrote
dvw wrote

Citizen Bob, could you elaborate on what you mean by "changing the
signature" when you use Acronis True Image Server to make full disk images?

Each partition has a unique "signature" which Windows uses
to mount the device driver for that disk. That saves having to set
up the driver each time. It also prevents cloning because Windows
will BSOD if there are two disks with identical signatures.

XP doesnt BSOD in that situation.

Win98SE has a bug in FDISK /MBR which overwrites the first 4 bytes of
the signature. That forces Windows to abandon previous drivers and create
a new one. It creates a new signature and a driver to go along with it.

It doesnt have separate drivers either.

Even though you will not mount the old and the new disks at the same
time, the new one is NOT identical to the old one even though it is a
clone. Therefore it can get corrupted if it uses the driver from the old
drive. So I always zero out the signature when I do a hardcopy clone.

Makes more sense to not do backup by cloning.

I did a compare of things I just bought
I didn't see a Big difference in price.
(However they didn't have the exact model I had)

But it's always good to find new sources for products thanks, Bob

I've had very good results with SuperGoodDeal.
They haven't done the take your order, then 1 week later let you know it's
out of stock Crap
like other places has done to me.
Most of the time I get it in less than 1 week.. and that's Shipped UPS

Russ

--
Russell Grover
Microsoft Certified Small Business Specialist.
MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, (MCP-SBS)
Remote Support Available
MSN Messenger
Support @ SBITS.Biz
http://www.SBITS.Biz
Search for SBS2003 answer on Google:
http://groups.google.com/group/micro...s?lnk=lr&hl=en


"Citizen Bob" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 02:15:41 -0700, "Russ - SBITS.Biz \(MCP SBS\)"
wrote:

http://www.supergooddeal.com/category_s/42.htm

Directron is a lot less expensive.

http://www.directron.com/




--

"Nothing in the world can take the place of perseverence. Talent
will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education
will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and
determination alone are omnipotent."
--Calvin Coolidge

OK I like the FREE stuff..
You've sold me BOB

Thanks...

Russ

--
Russell Grover
Microsoft Certified Small Business Specialist.
MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, (MCP-SBS)
Remote Support Available
MSN Messenger
Support @ SBITS.Biz
http://www.SBITS.Biz
Search for SBS2003 answer on Google:
http://groups.google.com/group/micro...s?lnk=lr&hl=en


"Citizen Bob" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 02:15:41 -0700, "Russ - SBITS.Biz \(MCP SBS\)"
wrote:

http://www.supergooddeal.com/category_s/42.htm

Directron is a lot less expensive.

http://www.directron.com/




--

"Nothing in the world can take the place of perseverence. Talent
will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education
will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and
determination alone are omnipotent."
--Calvin Coolidge

On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:49:03 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote:

There are real downsides with using cloning for backup,
particularly its much too easy to clone backwards
and overwrite what you are trying to backup.

Not if you put a physical label on the disks.

Not even possible to see that with most systems.

The cloning procedure requires the use of removable drive bays.
Therefore I put the label on the front of the disk tray.

Makes a lot more sense to use a decent modern incremental
imager and have it look after all that stuff auto and completely
eliminate any possibility of cloning backwards.

MUCH faster too.

I am sure it is. But I do not trust it. I was unable to get Acronis to
operate in that mode. I did not spend the time to chase it down, since
I wanted to do cloning instead.

Fraid so when you dont have the drives in removable bays and
prefer to have the backup drive in another PC across the lan etc.

I thought Acronis TI would do LAN disk clones.

Neither should you, you should be using a decent modern incremental
imager instead so you get the backup done much more quickly as a
bonus and you dont have to fart around with removable drives either.

Once you bin the removable drive bays, the backup can be completely
automated and you dont have to wait around for it to happen either.
Just check that the automated backup did work properly after the event.

I prefer keeping the disks in a location away from the computer. If I
do imaging with disks permanently mounted in the computer, I take the
risk that something could happen to them.


--

"Nothing in the world can take the place of perseverence. Talent
will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education
will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and
determination alone are omnipotent."
--Calvin Coolidge