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A graphics card with video capture



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 2nd 04, 11:52 AM
Hupjack
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Default A graphics card with video capture

For those of you that have already read my plight, I'll keep this short.
I mistakenly got an A7V8X-X instead of the A7N8X-X, so I'm just going to
build another computer around the Via board, sell it, and get myself the
nForce board that I wanted.

Well I'm short on graphics cards so I'm also going to sell my Asus V7100
GeForce2 with the Via board, and get myself a new AGP card.

I've been wanting to encode some VHS video to digital for a while now, and
while I twiddle my thumbs, my videos are busy decomposing as we speak :-\

I'm looking for a card with video capture, and while I'm busy upgrading, I
figured I might as well prep for a future flat panel display and get a video
card with a DVI output. I also figured since I'm going to have an AGP 8x
motherboard, I might as well get a graphics card to match.

Having read too many posts, I've learned that all sorts of folk over at
rec.video.desktop are ga ga for the $260 Canopus ADVC-100
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=&sku= 244508

I'm pretty sure my analog to digital conversion days will be over once I get
the ones I have lying around converted, so I'm not super keen on investing
$260 for hardware that I'll only use once. Having read post after post
about how great this external box is, I finally found a reference to this
page http://www.digitalfaq.com/othervideo/buyerguide.htm expounding on the
wonders of the ATI all in wonder series for the same purpose. So now I have
some info on using a graphics cards to do the capture.

I also don't know if I should really care to get a card with DVI out. A
quick peak at Viewsonic's products showed that many if not most of the flat
panels have the old VGA connectors as well. Seems stupid to do a digital to
analog and back to digital conversion when I have the option to go straight
digital. So am I wise to get a video card with DVI out at this day and age?

Since I wasn't too keen on the $260 for that external box, you can imagine
I'm not interested in spending that much for a graphics card either. I'm
not a hard core gamer. I was hoping to get a recommendation for a video
card that could capture video and perhaps also have that DVI out. I guess
matching my AGP 8x capable board would be a third place priority since I'm
not a gamer. There were a ton of All-in-Wonders available, but I've got to
assume there are nVidia or Matrox cards that would also fit the bill. Just
like my A7N8X-X and the Athlon 2500+, I'm looking for a great graphics card
that will do the video capture, but is also a great price. Any suggestions?

If there are any nVidia based products that fit the bill, that might be
good. I know somebody that works there.. Discount possibilities....

Frankly, I'd rather convince my friend with a G4 Powermac, DVD-R, and
digital camera to let me use his hardware to transfer my VHS to DVD, but he
hasn't had any free time, and I think he isn't planning on making any.
Maybe that will work out, or I'll find a friend with an all-in-wonder, use
his for my little job, and then I can buy a video card without this annoying
video capture constraint.. Assuming my other schemes fail and I need to do
the video capture myself though, what graphics cards should I look at?

Thanks,
-Ethan
--
To e-mail me, replace "_nospamtoday_" with the "@" symbol when replying to
my address.


  #2  
Old April 2nd 04, 01:04 PM
John McGaw
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Posts: n/a
Default

"Hupjack" hupjack_nospamtoday_yahoo.com wrote in message
...
For those of you that have already read my plight, I'll keep this short.
I mistakenly got an A7V8X-X instead of the A7N8X-X, so I'm just going to
build another computer around the Via board, sell it, and get myself the
nForce board that I wanted.

snip...
Frankly, I'd rather convince my friend with a G4 Powermac, DVD-R, and
digital camera to let me use his hardware to transfer my VHS to DVD, but

he
hasn't had any free time, and I think he isn't planning on making any.
Maybe that will work out, or I'll find a friend with an all-in-wonder, use
his for my little job, and then I can buy a video card without this

annoying
video capture constraint.. Assuming my other schemes fail and I need to

do
the video capture myself though, what graphics cards should I look at?

Thanks,
-Ethan
--
To e-mail me, replace "_nospamtoday_" with the "@" symbol when replying to
my address.

I bought an Asus Radeon 9600XT for my most recent box. The video is
excellent, it has DVI, dual monitor support, and video capture. Best of all
it isn't very expensive.
--
John McGaw
[Knoxville, TN, USA]
http://johnmcgaw.com



  #3  
Old April 2nd 04, 05:19 PM
Kris Rawlison
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Default


"Hupjack" hupjack_nospamtoday_yahoo.com wrote in message
...
I'm pretty sure my analog to digital conversion days will be over once I

get
the ones I have lying around converted, so I'm not super keen on investing
$260 for hardware that I'll only use once. Having read post after post
about how great this external box is, I finally found a reference to this
page http://www.digitalfaq.com/othervideo/buyerguide.htm expounding on the
wonders of the ATI all in wonder series for the same purpose. So now I

have
some info on using a graphics cards to do the capture.

I also don't know if I should really care to get a card with DVI out. A
quick peak at Viewsonic's products showed that many if not most of the

flat
panels have the old VGA connectors as well. Seems stupid to do a digital

to
analog and back to digital conversion when I have the option to go

straight
digital. So am I wise to get a video card with DVI out at this day and

age?

First, about DVI on your graphics card. Get it, it's worth it. Firstly,
there's less signal degridation because you're only going through one
digital to analog conversion. With DVI, the signal stays digital from your
video card until it gets converted to an analog signal by your monitor when
an image is placed on the screen. With a regular VGA, your video card
converts the digital image to analog when it gets sent along your monitor
cable, you monitor then converts it back to digital to do any type of
manipulation to it (contrast, brightness, the vert/horizontal stretch or
position, etc) and then it gets transferred back to analog when it is
finally sent to the display element. Secondly, the fact that the signal is
digital between your video card and your monitor allows for less signal
degredation as its going along the cable, so you can run DVI cables farther
(I've seen cables as long as 10 meters, and they make repeaters that allow
you pretty much unlimited length so long as you're willing to pay to chain
enough together).
LCDs with DVI interfaces are getting cheaper and cheaper. On average it's
about $30-60 difference depending on the band and features. If you're going
to be using your computer a lot, it's worth the price. You'll get less
ghosting and a crisper image.

As far as the card choice, well you can do one of two things.

A) Go separate video capture card and graphics card. You can get one of the
ATI tuner cards for approx. $50 USD before shipping if you look around, most
chain stores like BestBuy, CompUSA, Fry's, CircuitCity, etc. carry them in
stock if you don't want to wait for mail order. Then you can get a separate
graphics card. Stay away from the GeForce4 MX series cards they're total
garbage unless you're only doing business apps. If you do any gaming at
all, shoot for a cheap nVidia Titanium series or something in the ATI 9600
series. Since you don't do a ton of gaming, they should last you a good
couple years easy, and they're not going to break the bank.

B) Go for a combination card like the All In Wonder like you mentioned. I
have no experience with the AIWs but I've heard they're quite good. There
is no real difference in the AIW cards as opposed to the regular ATI cards
aside from the tuner being added on, so an AIW 9600 will give you the same
performance as a Raedon 9600 without the tuner. You can get an nVidia card
with tuning ability also. I have a LeadTek A280 MyVIVO and am quite happy
with it, it's served me quite well, although I can't comment on its capture
ability since I haven't tried that part of it yet.

I would suggest an integrated card unless you absolutely want say an ATI
tuner card and a nVidia graphics card or vice versa. There's less hassle
and less worry about device conflicts or driver conflicts, and usually its
cheaper. For example, on newegg, you're going to save about $30 going for
the AIW ($130) as opposed to separate cards, and an nVidia Ti4200 based
Chaintech or Ti4600 based MSI for the $130 range. Considering it's about
half the price of that little box you heard about, not a bad deal.

Anyway, hope this helped.



  #4  
Old April 3rd 04, 08:09 AM
Hupjack
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Posts: n/a
Default

I bought an Asus Radeon 9600XT for my most recent box. The video is
excellent, it has DVI, dual monitor support, and video capture. Best of

all
it isn't very expensive.


looks like a great suggestion.. it certainly does look like a kick ass
card for a decent price.
I suppose $170.00 for that bad boy isn't super expensive. I guess only the
XT has video capture... I like the lesser price of this Rosewill 9600SE
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...164-006&depa=0
but no video capture.
For that matter, I also like the amazing $30 price tag at Frys right now for
this PNY GeForce4 MX440
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...133-086&depa=0

I mean $30!!! I can almost get six of them for the same price as that ATI
card. Of course I'd have 6 cards, none of which would have video capture
:-)
Funny.... Kris warned me to stay away from the GeForce4 MX, as if he had a
premonition that I was going to be drawn to that frys price. Are they
really that bad? I mean they can't be worse than my Asus V7100 GeForce2 Pro
and I'm feeling quite zippy with that card. I wouldn't even be ditching it
if I didn't feel the need to switch the motherboard to the A7N8X that I
meant to get.

Now I've got more options to consider.. in today's frys add I spotted this
Dazzle multimedia external usb option
http://www.pinnaclesys.com/menusuppo...roduct_id=1427 on sale for
$40, a similar avermedia USB 2.0 dealy bopper
http://www.aver.com/products/dvm_AVe...aker_usb.shtml for $50, and an
avermedia analog capture card for $40
http://www.aver.com/products/dvm_AVerDVD_ezMaker.shtml.

so I guess there is more out there than just the badass $260 Canopus
ADVC-100 and the AIW cards.
I gotta admit, I'm really tempted by the $30 PNY GeForce4 MX440. I could
also get one of these external USB deals, and I'd still be at less than half
the price of a Radeon 9600XT.

This Radeon 8500DV is pretty attractive too
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduc...02-195R&depa=0
but the refurb might be a bit of trouble. I wouldn't get any of the cables?
It says no DVI to VGA Adaptor, but there are a lot of other important cables
too.. No input output adapter with the refurb? Does ATI hook you up if you
call them up and say you got a refurb and need the cables?


  #5  
Old April 3rd 04, 08:54 AM
Hupjack
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Posts: n/a
Default

good lord... here's that 8500DV again...
http://tinyurl.com/2qkf2 - fricken $99, but without the remote.. Coming
with an RF remote is groovy.. This white box has more than the newegg
refurb but still no remote.. This fricken card is a monster.. it has two
firewire ports too? It's got everything but the kitchen sink!!

Kris is this what you had in mind when you said entry level Ti card?
http://usa.asus.com/prog/spec.asp?m=V9280%20TD&langs=09

it says "Multi-Video in/TV out adaptor DVI out adapter"
Does this thing do video capture or what?

this one certainly says more clearly that it does
http://usa.asus.com/products/vga/v9480tvd/overview.htm#
"Diversified display connectivity (Dual VGA, DVI-I, TV-out, Video-in)"

That's what I like to see.. "video in"


  #6  
Old April 3rd 04, 08:56 AM
gothika
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Default

On Fri, 2 Apr 2004 23:09:09 -0800, "Hupjack"
hupjack_nospamtoday_yahoo.com wrote:

I bought an Asus Radeon 9600XT for my most recent box. The video is
excellent, it has DVI, dual monitor support, and video capture. Best of

all
it isn't very expensive.


looks like a great suggestion.. it certainly does look like a kick ass
card for a decent price.
I suppose $170.00 for that bad boy isn't super expensive. I guess only the
XT has video capture... I like the lesser price of this Rosewill 9600SE
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...164-006&depa=0
but no video capture.
For that matter, I also like the amazing $30 price tag at Frys right now for
this PNY GeForce4 MX440
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...133-086&depa=0

I mean $30!!! I can almost get six of them for the same price as that ATI
card. Of course I'd have 6 cards, none of which would have video capture
:-)
Funny.... Kris warned me to stay away from the GeForce4 MX, as if he had a
premonition that I was going to be drawn to that frys price. Are they
really that bad? I mean they can't be worse than my Asus V7100 GeForce2 Pro
and I'm feeling quite zippy with that card. I wouldn't even be ditching it
if I didn't feel the need to switch the motherboard to the A7N8X that I
meant to get.

I use the Geforce MX/MX 400 in my systems and they do good work.
(I don't game though just video editing and some still graphic work)
Now I've got more options to consider.. in today's frys add I spotted this
Dazzle multimedia external usb option
http://www.pinnaclesys.com/menusuppo...roduct_id=1427 on sale for
$40, a similar avermedia USB 2.0 dealy bopper
http://www.aver.com/products/dvm_AVe...aker_usb.shtml for $50, and an
avermedia analog capture card for $40
http://www.aver.com/products/dvm_AVerDVD_ezMaker.shtml.

so I guess there is more out there than just the badass $260 Canopus
ADVC-100 and the AIW cards.
I gotta admit, I'm really tempted by the $30 PNY GeForce4 MX440. I could
also get one of these external USB deals, and I'd still be at less than half
the price of a Radeon 9600XT.

This Radeon 8500DV is pretty attractive too
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduc...02-195R&depa=0
but the refurb might be a bit of trouble. I wouldn't get any of the cables?
It says no DVI to VGA Adaptor, but there are a lot of other important cables
too.. No input output adapter with the refurb? Does ATI hook you up if you
call them up and say you got a refurb and need the cables?


  #7  
Old April 3rd 04, 09:41 AM
Hupjack
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Posts: n/a
Default

good lord.. this is really a pain in the ass sifting through the billion
different nvidia cards for the ones with video in. Like.. the Asus model
using the Ti4200-8X that has video in is the V9280 VS.. But there are two
other Asus Ti4200-8X cards that don't have it.. Searching for an nvidia
with video in, I feel like I have a 1/3 shot of finding one..

Any smart way to somehow restrict my browsing to cards with video in?


  #8  
Old April 3rd 04, 10:31 AM
Kris Rawlison
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Posts: n/a
Default


"Hupjack" hupjack_nospamtoday_yahoo.com wrote in message
...
good lord... here's that 8500DV again...
http://tinyurl.com/2qkf2 - fricken $99, but without the remote.. Coming
with an RF remote is groovy.. This white box has more than the newegg
refurb but still no remote.. This fricken card is a monster.. it has two
firewire ports too? It's got everything but the kitchen sink!!

Kris is this what you had in mind when you said entry level Ti card?
http://usa.asus.com/prog/spec.asp?m=V9280%20TD&langs=09

it says "Multi-Video in/TV out adaptor DVI out adapter"
Does this thing do video capture or what?

this one certainly says more clearly that it does
http://usa.asus.com/products/vga/v9480tvd/overview.htm#
"Diversified display connectivity (Dual VGA, DVI-I, TV-out, Video-in)"

That's what I like to see.. "video in"


The reason I said to stay away from the GeForce4 MX series is that they are
basically crippled cards. They're only DirectX 7 compliant as they don't
support DirectX 8 pixel and vertex shaders. Not the end of the world mind
you, but if you're looking at only upgrading one every couple years, the
extra bucks now may wind up saving you a lot of hassle later you know?

As far as what I meant by an entry level Ti card, that's a great example.
My Leadtek is pretty much the same card, although ASUS usually gives better
goodies with their cards As far as third party cards, those made by
manufacturer using a chipset from a different company, they are all pretty
much within 5% of each other performancewise unless the manufacturer does a
lot of tweaking, and not many do. Basically, they will follow what is
called a "reference design" and then add on their own goodies. Anyway, if
you're looking for a card that can do TV capture, look for things like
"VIVO," "video in," "CATV in," things like that. Check out newegg.com, and
zipzoomfly.com that should make things pretty quick. If you like the remote
though, the only cards I know that have them are the ATI All-In-Wonders.
They're damn good cards, and you can find them at a decent price.


  #9  
Old April 3rd 04, 10:37 AM
kony
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On Fri, 2 Apr 2004 23:09:09 -0800, "Hupjack"
hupjack_nospamtoday_yahoo.com wrote:

snip

For gaming, the GF4MX cards are relatively slow, but if you were happy
with the GF2Pro you'll have a minor performance increase with the GF4MX.
$30 for it is a relatively good deal, it wouldn't make sense to spend 5X
as much if you're not into semi-modern 3D gaming.

Don't sweat the video capture... if you don't need a tuner then simply buy
a PCI capture card, they're about $20-30. There is no need to buy
high-end or hardware compression gear, nor an AIW, that price-premium,
simply to capture a few videos.
  #10  
Old April 3rd 04, 10:40 AM
kony
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Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 00:41:36 -0800, "Hupjack"
hupjack_nospamtoday_yahoo.com wrote:

good lord.. this is really a pain in the ass sifting through the billion
different nvidia cards for the ones with video in. Like.. the Asus model
using the Ti4200-8X that has video in is the V9280 VS.. But there are two
other Asus Ti4200-8X cards that don't have it.. Searching for an nvidia
with video in, I feel like I have a 1/3 shot of finding one..

Any smart way to somehow restrict my browsing to cards with video in?


You could go to Newegg.com and input the search KEYWORD "VIVO"...
http://www.newegg.com/app/manufactor...alog=48&DEPA=0

 




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