Canon Users - Do You Believe????

Arthur Entlich wrote:

Wow, I think this posting has to top the "ill-informed" "misinformed"
and "downright wrong" prize!!!

In article , says...


IT SEEMS THE GUY MAKES A LOT OF SENSE.

I BELIEVE WHAT THE POSTER IS SAYING

So, here you have it: It appears the 2 biggest idiots on the 6 inner
planets agree. That should tell us something!

digisol wrote:
And for the Canon users don't feel left out, "read it"

Canon U.S A Inc ("Canon USA") warrants its Visualizers to be free from
defects in workmanship and materials under normal use and maintenance
conditions for a Period of one (1) year from delivery to the original
purchaser by Canon USA or its authorized dealer. During such warranty
period, defective Equipment which is returned to Canon USA's Factory
Service Center and proven to be defective upon inspection will be
repaired or exchanged for new or comparable rebuilt Equipment.
Warranty replacement shall not extend the warranty period of the
defective Equipment.

When returning Equipment to Canon USA's Factory Service Center
indicated on the limited warranty card, the purchaser must pre-pay
the shipping charges, if any and enclose a bill of sale, copy of
warranty card, or other proof of purchase together with a complete
explanation of the problem. Equipment covered by this limited
warranty will be repaired and returned to the purchaser without
charge. Repairs not under warranty will beat such cost as Canon USA
may from time to time generally establish.

This warranty does not extend to used Equipment or to software. The
purchaser will be solely responsible for obtaining and installing all
required software, programming design or coding, as to all of which
Canon USA shall have no responsibility.

This warranty shall only apply if the Equipment is used in conjunction
with compatible computers, peripheral equipment and software, as to
which items Canon USA shall have no responsibility.

NON-CANON BRAND COMPUTERS, PERIPHERAL EQUIPMENT AND SOFTWARE WHICH MAY
BE DISTRIBUTED WITH THE EQUIPMENT ARE SOLD "AS IS', WITHOUT WARRANTY
OF ANY KIND BY CANON USA, INCLUDING ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF
MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. The sole
warranty, if any, with respect to any such non-Canon brand item is
given by the manufacturer or producer thereof. Separate warranties
are given for other Canon brand products, accessories or software
which may be used with the Equipment.

THIS WARRANTY SHALL BE VOID AND OF NO FORCE AND EFFECT WITH RESPECT TO
ANY EQUIPMENT WHICH IS DAMAGED AS A RESULT OF; (A) NEGLECT,
ALTERATION. ELECTRIC CURRENT FLUCTUATION OR ACCIDENT; (B) IMPROPER
USE, INCLUDING FAILURE TO FOLLOW OPERATING, MAINTENANCE AND
ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS PRESCRIBED IN CANON USA'S INSTRUCTION
MANUAL; (C) REPAIR BY OTHER THAN SERVICE REPRESENTATIVES QUALIFIED BY
CANON USA AND ACTING IN ACCORDANCE WITH CANON USA'S SERVICE BULLETINS;
(D) USE OF SUPPLIES OR PARTS (OTHER THAN THOSE DISTRIBUTED BY CANON
USA) WHICH CAUSE ABNORMALLY FREOUENT SERVICE CALLS OR SERVICE
PROBLEMS;OR (E) USE OF THE EQUIPMENT WITH NON-COMPATIBLE COMPUTERS,
DEVICES OR SOFTWARE. NOR DOES THIS WARRANTY EXTEND TO ANY EQUIPMENT
ON WHICH THE ORIGINAL IDENTIFICATION MARKS OR SERIAL NUMBERS HAVE
BEEN DEFACED, REMOVED OR ALTERED.

THE WARRANTY CONTAINED ABOVE IS IN LIEU OP ALL OTHER WARRANTIES,
EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY
OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, RELATING TO THE USE OR
PERFORMANCE OF THE EQUIPMENT. NO OTHER EXPRESS WARRANTY OR GUARANTEE
EXCEPT AS MENTIONED ABOVE, GIVEN BY ANY PERSON, FIRM, OR CORPORATION
WITH RESPECT TO THE EQUIPMENT SHALL BIND CANON USA. CANON USA WILL
NOT BE LIABLE FOR PERSONAL INJURY OR PROPERTY DAMAGE (UNLESS CAUSED
SOLELY BY CANON USA'S NEGLIGENCE), LOSS OF REVENUE OR PROFIT, FAILURE
TO REALIZE SAVINGS OR OTHER BENEFITS, EXPENDITURES FOR SUBSTITUTE
EQUIPMENT OR SERVICES, STORAGE CHARGES, LOSS OR CORRUPTION OF IMAGE
OR DATA, OR OTHER SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES
ARISING OUT OF THE USE, MISUSE OR INABILITY TO USE THE EQUIPMENT,
REGARDLESS OF THE LEGAL THEORY ON WHICH THE CLAIM IS BASED AND EVEN
IF CANON USA HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. IN
NO EVENT SHALL CANON USA'S LIABILITY HEREUNDER EXCEED THE SELLING
PRICE OF THE EQUIPMENT TO THE PURCHASER. WITHOUT LIMITING THE
FOREGOING, THE PURCHASER ASSUMES ALL RISK AND LIABILITY FOR LOSS.
DAMAGE OR INJURY TO PERSONS AND PROPERTY OF THE PURCHASER OR OTHERS
ARISING OUT OF USE OR POSSESSION OF ANY EQUIPMENT SOLD BY CANON USA
NOT CAUSED DIRECTLY BY THE NEGLIGENCE OF CANON USA. THIS LIMITED
WARRANTY SHALL NOT EXTEND TO ANYONE OTHER THAN THE ORIGINAL PURCHASER
OF THE EQUIPMENT AND STATES SUCH PURCHASER'S EXCLUSIVE REMEDY.


I rest my case, use the cheap ink at your own risk, the companies will
NOT fix em due to cheap non genuine ink,

Does no one bother to read the warranties they get ?


You may rest your case, but the above nowhere
refers to ink.

In any case, the above is not the same as the
warranty stated in my Pixma iP4000 Quick Start
Guide. The warranty in my book says nothing about
consumables except to state that the warranty does
not include consumables such as ink and paper
which are not covered. You may argue that the
above mention of "supplies" refers to ink, but my
warranty clearly differentiates "supplies" from
"consumables" and gives ink as an example of the
latter.

Burt wrote:
"digisol" wrote in message
...

And for the Canon users don't feel left out, "read it"


No, digisol, YOU read it. There were only two areas in the entire post that
MIGHT relate to inks. The first is this one:


This warranty shall only apply if the Equipment is used in conjunction
with compatible computers, peripheral equipment and software, as to
which items Canon USA shall have no responsibility.


no mention of ink or consumables at all.

The second area:

(D) USE OF SUPPLIES OR PARTS (OTHER THAN THOSE DISTRIBUTED BY CANON

USA) WHICH CAUSE ABNORMALLY FREOUENT SERVICE CALLS OR SERVICE
PROBLEMS


After using MIS inks for over a year I can catagorically state that they do
not "cause abnormally frequent service calls or service problems." You will
find similar reports in this NG about Formulabs and Hobbicolor inks.
Furthermore, there have been several articles which indicate that the
printer companies (at least in the US) can not void the warranty based on
use of aftermarket inks.


Burt, ink is not a "supply" or a "part." Canon
clearly states that ink and paper are
"consumables" to differentiate it from a "supply"
or "part" which is handled differently in the U.S.
warranty.

George E. Cawthon wrote:

Burt wrote:

"digisol" wrote in message
...

And for the Canon users don't feel left out, "read it"



No, digisol, YOU read it. There were only two areas in the entire
post that MIGHT relate to inks. The first is this one:


This warranty shall only apply if the Equipment is used in conjunction
with compatible computers, peripheral equipment and software, as to
which items Canon USA shall have no responsibility.



no mention of ink or consumables at all.

The second area:

(D) USE OF SUPPLIES OR PARTS (OTHER THAN THOSE DISTRIBUTED BY CANON

USA) WHICH CAUSE ABNORMALLY FREOUENT SERVICE CALLS OR SERVICE
PROBLEMS



After using MIS inks for over a year I can catagorically state that
they do not "cause abnormally frequent service calls or service
problems." You will find similar reports in this NG about Formulabs
and Hobbicolor inks. Furthermore, there have been several articles
which indicate that the printer companies (at least in the US) can
not void the warranty based on use of aftermarket inks.



Burt, ink is not a "supply" or a "part." Canon clearly states that
ink and paper are "consumables" to differentiate it from a "supply" or
"part" which is handled differently in the U.S. warranty.

GOTO TO THE CANON WEBSITE AND CHOOSE A PRINTER LIKE THE IP5200 AND THEN
CLICK SUPPORT. YOU WILL FIND A BUNCH OF BOXES WITH LINKS. ONE OF THEM IS

Supplies & Accessories
http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/controller?act=SNAModelSuppliesAct&fcategoryid=857 &modelid=11993

CLICK THIS AND YOU WILL FIND ALL OF THE INFORMATION ABOUT THEIR INK CARTS.

LOVE IT LOVE IT LOVE IT

George E. Cawthon wrote:

digisol wrote:

And for the Canon users don't feel left out, "read it"

Canon U.S A Inc ("Canon USA") warrants its Visualizers to be free from
defects in workmanship and materials under normal use and maintenance
conditions for a Period of one (1) year from delivery to the original
purchaser by Canon USA or its authorized dealer. During such warranty
period, defective Equipment which is returned to Canon USA's Factory
Service Center and proven to be defective upon inspection will be
repaired or exchanged for new or comparable rebuilt Equipment.
Warranty replacement shall not extend the warranty period of the
defective Equipment.

When returning Equipment to Canon USA's Factory Service Center
indicated on the limited warranty card, the purchaser must pre-pay
the shipping charges, if any and enclose a bill of sale, copy of
warranty card, or other proof of purchase together with a complete
explanation of the problem. Equipment covered by this limited
warranty will be repaired and returned to the purchaser without
charge. Repairs not under warranty will beat such cost as Canon USA
may from time to time generally establish.

This warranty does not extend to used Equipment or to software. The
purchaser will be solely responsible for obtaining and installing all
required software, programming design or coding, as to all of which
Canon USA shall have no responsibility.

This warranty shall only apply if the Equipment is used in conjunction
with compatible computers, peripheral equipment and software, as to
which items Canon USA shall have no responsibility.

NON-CANON BRAND COMPUTERS, PERIPHERAL EQUIPMENT AND SOFTWARE WHICH MAY
BE DISTRIBUTED WITH THE EQUIPMENT ARE SOLD "AS IS', WITHOUT WARRANTY
OF ANY KIND BY CANON USA, INCLUDING ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF
MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. The sole
warranty, if any, with respect to any such non-Canon brand item is
given by the manufacturer or producer thereof. Separate warranties
are given for other Canon brand products, accessories or software
which may be used with the Equipment.

THIS WARRANTY SHALL BE VOID AND OF NO FORCE AND EFFECT WITH RESPECT TO
ANY EQUIPMENT WHICH IS DAMAGED AS A RESULT OF; (A) NEGLECT,
ALTERATION. ELECTRIC CURRENT FLUCTUATION OR ACCIDENT; (B) IMPROPER
USE, INCLUDING FAILURE TO FOLLOW OPERATING, MAINTENANCE AND
ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS PRESCRIBED IN CANON USA'S INSTRUCTION
MANUAL; (C) REPAIR BY OTHER THAN SERVICE REPRESENTATIVES QUALIFIED BY
CANON USA AND ACTING IN ACCORDANCE WITH CANON USA'S SERVICE BULLETINS;
(D) USE OF SUPPLIES OR PARTS (OTHER THAN THOSE DISTRIBUTED BY CANON
USA) WHICH CAUSE ABNORMALLY FREOUENT SERVICE CALLS OR SERVICE
PROBLEMS;OR (E) USE OF THE EQUIPMENT WITH NON-COMPATIBLE COMPUTERS,
DEVICES OR SOFTWARE. NOR DOES THIS WARRANTY EXTEND TO ANY EQUIPMENT
ON WHICH THE ORIGINAL IDENTIFICATION MARKS OR SERIAL NUMBERS HAVE
BEEN DEFACED, REMOVED OR ALTERED.

THE WARRANTY CONTAINED ABOVE IS IN LIEU OP ALL OTHER WARRANTIES,
EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY
OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, RELATING TO THE USE OR
PERFORMANCE OF THE EQUIPMENT. NO OTHER EXPRESS WARRANTY OR GUARANTEE
EXCEPT AS MENTIONED ABOVE, GIVEN BY ANY PERSON, FIRM, OR CORPORATION
WITH RESPECT TO THE EQUIPMENT SHALL BIND CANON USA. CANON USA WILL
NOT BE LIABLE FOR PERSONAL INJURY OR PROPERTY DAMAGE (UNLESS CAUSED
SOLELY BY CANON USA'S NEGLIGENCE), LOSS OF REVENUE OR PROFIT, FAILURE
TO REALIZE SAVINGS OR OTHER BENEFITS, EXPENDITURES FOR SUBSTITUTE
EQUIPMENT OR SERVICES, STORAGE CHARGES, LOSS OR CORRUPTION OF IMAGE
OR DATA, OR OTHER SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES
ARISING OUT OF THE USE, MISUSE OR INABILITY TO USE THE EQUIPMENT,
REGARDLESS OF THE LEGAL THEORY ON WHICH THE CLAIM IS BASED AND EVEN
IF CANON USA HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. IN
NO EVENT SHALL CANON USA'S LIABILITY HEREUNDER EXCEED THE SELLING
PRICE OF THE EQUIPMENT TO THE PURCHASER. WITHOUT LIMITING THE
FOREGOING, THE PURCHASER ASSUMES ALL RISK AND LIABILITY FOR LOSS.
DAMAGE OR INJURY TO PERSONS AND PROPERTY OF THE PURCHASER OR OTHERS
ARISING OUT OF USE OR POSSESSION OF ANY EQUIPMENT SOLD BY CANON USA
NOT CAUSED DIRECTLY BY THE NEGLIGENCE OF CANON USA. THIS LIMITED
WARRANTY SHALL NOT EXTEND TO ANYONE OTHER THAN THE ORIGINAL PURCHASER
OF THE EQUIPMENT AND STATES SUCH PURCHASER'S EXCLUSIVE REMEDY.


I rest my case, use the cheap ink at your own risk, the companies will
NOT fix em due to cheap non genuine ink,
Does no one bother to read the warranties they get ?


You may rest your case, but the above nowhere refers to ink.

In any case, the above is not the same as the warranty stated in my
Pixma iP4000 Quick Start Guide. The warranty in my book says nothing
about consumables except to state that the warranty does not include
consumables such as ink and paper which are not covered. You may
argue that the above mention of "supplies" refers to ink, but my
warranty clearly differentiates "supplies" from "consumables" and
gives ink as an example of the latter.

CANON HAS A LINKE ON THEIR WEBSITE Supplies & Accessories
http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/controller?act=SNAModelSuppliesAct&fcategoryid=857 &modelid=11993
AND BY CLICKING IT YOU GET A LIST OF THEIR INK CARTS.

Ron Shaw wrote:

Arthur Entlich wrote:



Wow, I think this posting has to top the "ill-informed" "misinformed"
and "downright wrong" prize!!!





In article , says...






IT SEEMS THE GUY MAKES A LOT OF SENSE.

I BELIEVE WHAT THE POSTER IS SAYING



So, here you have it: It appears the 2 biggest idiots on the 6 inner
planets agree. That should tell us something!


:-D

drc023 wrote:

"measekite" wrote in message
.net...


Burt wrote:



snipped.


YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT AFTERMARKET INK VENDORS ARE SELLING BECAUSE THEY WILL
NOT DISCLOSE THAT INFORMATION


What difference does that make?

THE STATEMENT ABOVE IS INDIRECT AGREEMENT BY INFERENCE

If it works and provides the desired results
that's all that matters -

BUT IT DOESN'T

unless you are so impressed by designer labels
that you want to brag about where you bought it and how much you spent. But
if you want assurances that the ink is from a particular source, be sure to
order bulk ink from a vendor who specifices the manufacturer or the ink they
sell, such as Formulabs from alotofthings.com

YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT IT IS. YOU HAVE TO HUNT FOR A LITTLE THING THAT IS
NOT NEXT TO WHAT YOU BUY. THE BOXES AND LABELS DO NOT SELL FORMULABS
AND ALL OF THEIR PREFILLED GENERIC CARTS DO NOT CONTAIN FORMULABS. THEY
DO NOT DISCLOSE WHAT THEY MAKE.

SNIPPED

fb wrote:

zakezuke wrote:

they say that if damage to the printer is caused by not using
genuine ink they do not
have to repair it under the warranty
not exactly true. they say that if damage to the printer is caused
by not using
genuine ink they do not have to repair it under the warranty



Exactly... when measekite and I can agree on something it simply must
be true. digisol was trying to claim that the warranty on the printer
was void when in reality if you the wrong kind of ink in your printer
and it totally screws up it's only the part of the printer it damages
that they might not fix. Sometimes you sir can be a complete bozo but
in this case you see some common sense.

Now given that a printhead clog is something the end user can *fix* in
most cases rather than a head burn out, as you just said measkete the
warranty on the printer it self is still 100% valid.

So respectfuly digisol... measkite can't even agree with you, lol.

Here's the deal. If you put castrol oil in your printer and it stopped
working and was under warranty, you will more than likely not get it
repaired under warranty because castrol oil is not GENUINE INK.
However, if your printer stopped working under normal use conditions
and you were using after market inks (GENUINE INK)or carts (filled
with GENUINE INK), they have to repair the printer or else they must
supply independent scientific proof, that will legally hold up in
court, that the GENUINE ink or carts(filled with GENUINE INK)you were
using, caused the printer to stop working.
The large printer manufacturers want nothing to do with a binding
court case involving after market GENUINE inks and carts(filled with
GENUINE INK). T

THREE LARGE COMPANIES MAKE GENUINE INK. ONE IS CANON AND THE OTHER TWO
ARE EPSON AND HP. THATS IT.

hey're too afraid of the outcome because they know for sure that
they will lose and the publicity generated would kill their very
lucrative, highly profitable oem ink business.
If anyone tells you they won't repair your printer under warranty
because the GENUINE INK you used did the damage...tell them to supply
in writing legal factual documented proof that this is true.
It'll never happen. Trust me, they don't want to go there and spoil
their own party.
And that's the truth!
Frank

WHAT A LONG RESPONSE. CANON WILL REPAIR THE PRINTER UNDER WARRATY IF
YOU USE GENUINE CANON INK FOR THAT IS ALL THAT IS GENUINE.

drc023 wrote:

"digisol" wrote in message
m...


LOL, BRING IT ON as the facts are in black and white, for the flamers,
your wick just just got wet and went out, bummer deal eh.

The facts are there for all to be read, it's easy to see and is in
English, allbeit some still may have trouble reading it.

With Epson, and I know via personal experience, they WILL NOT replace
your print head if you have used any non genuine inks, to do so comes
back to the warranty and what it means, it is meant to say that if you
do use non genuine inks you are in fact modifying their printer and by
doing so you VOID your warranty instantly, tough titties there.

Inks are not all the same, and while not an ink expert, some are oil
based some are water based and others may be all sorts of chemical
compounds, thus why Epson can know if your lying about having not
used generic ink, thay are MUCH SMARTER than some of you, inks are
not just inks, try it on and see.

But it's not like you were not told now were you ? you just simply
never bothered to read the fine print, usually in size 5-6 font
making it usually not read by most people, or did ya toss the
warranty as there were too many big words ?

As for Canon I had the same problem by using Calidad ink refills in a
Canon S-600, they worked for a few tanks then the head started to
block up and it was cheaper to but a brand new Pixma 4000 by over $50
AUD "which I did" of course it uses only genuine ink no matter the
price in all tanks being one of the converted.

So flame away if you are really dum enough to ignore the written
warranty, perhaps English is a second language with some ? who cares
? not me as my printer works fine.

CYA and don't go away mad, just go away.




Digisol, you have no credibility.

DIGISOL YOU HAVE A LOT OF CREDABILITY.

You flame on and on about OEM warranties
and how you are the expert on the fine print, but you obviously don't read
or understand other warranties.

IT APPEARS AFTER LOOKING AT THE CANON WARRANTY POSTED ON THE CANON
WEBSITE THAT HE DOES IN FACT KNOW WHAT HE IS TALKING ABOUT. SO WHY DO
ALL OF THE COCKROACHES COME OUT OF THE WOODWORK TO ATTACT DIGISOL. HE
INFACT MADE A VERY ACCURATE STATEMENT.

You claim (which I suspect is bogus) that


I BELIEVE HIM

Calidad ink damaged your printer and that you had to purchase a new model,
yet Calidad clearly states in their guarantee that if your printer is
damaged by their ink that they will repair or replace the item.


WHAT A JOKE. TRY AND COLLECT.

http://www.calidad.com.au/guarantee_large.asp If you are convinced and have
written proof from Epson that your printer was damaged by the Calidad ink,
then why didn't you get them to replace the printer for you? I've been
refilling various printers for years and have never had a printer damaged by
third party ink, but if I did I'd at least have enough common sense to allow
the supplier of the ink to make good on their warranty.

THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE ARE NOW USING OEM INK FOR THE SECOND TIME. THESE
ARE THE PEOPLE WHO LEARNED THEIR LESSON. IT IS LIKE PEOPLE BUYING A
HONDA AFTER THEY HAD THE HIUNDAI EXPERIENCE.

OTOH, please
continue, along with your alter ego - Measekite, to purchase the overpriced
OEM ink from Canon.

LIKE I SAID. IT IS OVERPRICED BUT MY PRINTLOAD IS SUCH THAT I DO NOT
NEED TO RISK MY PRINTER AND ACCEPT LOWER QUALITY RESULTS EITHER.

This will help insure that they continue to sell new
printers at rock bottom prices and ink cartridges at sky high prices.

SOON THEY WILL DEVELOP CHIPS IN THEIR CARTS THAT CANNOT BE DEFEATED AND
A NEW PRINTHEAD THAT WILL FAIL WITHOUT A SPECIAL SUBSTANCE IN THE INK
THAT IS A TRADE SECRET SO IT WILL ONLY PRINT ANYTHING WITH GENUINE INK.
I WOULD EXPECT EPSON GETS THEIR FIRST.

HP DOES IT BY INCORPORATING THE PRINTHEAD INTO THE CART AND MAKING IT AN
EVEN BIGGER PAIN TO REFILL AND ALSO MAKING THE PRINTHEAD TO HAVE A VERY
LIMITED LIFE.

DO I THINK INK IS TOO HIGH. YES I DO BUT SO IS GAS FOR YOUR CAR AND
HEAT FOR YOUR HOUSE AND IFYOU WANT TO SPEND $4.00 FOR A $3.00 BURGER
INSTEAD OF A REAL $6.00 BURGER THAN BE MY GUEST.

We
refillers appreciate your generosity in supporting the OEM market instead of
saving a bundle by using third party ink.

zakezuke wrote:

they say that if damage to the printer is caused by not using genuine ink they do not
have to repair it under the warranty
not exactly true. they say that if damage to the printer is caused by not using
genuine ink they do not have to repair it under the warranty



Exactly... when measekite and I can agree on something it simply must
be true. digisol was trying to claim that the warranty on the printer
was void when in reality if you the wrong kind of ink in your printer
and it totally screws up it's only the part of the printer it damages
that they might not fix. Sometimes you sir can be a complete bozo but
in this case you see some common sense.

Now given that a printhead clog is something the end user can *fix* in
most cases rather than a head burn out, as you just said measkete the
warranty on the printer it self is still 100% valid.

So respectfuly digisol... measkite can't even agree with you, lol.


I AM MEASEKITE. I AGREE WITH DIGISOL. NO IFS ANDS OR BUTTS