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#1
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What's coming up in hardware?
My P4 boxes are getting long in the tooth, so I'm lurking again and starting
to think of new builds. Maybe this winter. The new Penryn class of processors look promising, once the price gets down to the normal range, and I'm sure there will be a lot of new mainboard specs and peripherals options once they are mainstreamed. Is AMD coming out with a competing product? So what else should I be keeping my eye on and researching for the coming months? What do you know? |
#2
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What's coming up in hardware?
TVeblen wrote:
My P4 boxes are getting long in the tooth, so I'm lurking again and starting to think of new builds. Maybe this winter. The new Penryn class of processors look promising, once the price gets down to the normal range, and I'm sure there will be a lot of new mainboard specs and peripherals options once they are mainstreamed. Is AMD coming out with a competing product? So what else should I be keeping my eye on and researching for the coming months? What do you know? The next thing for Intel, is Nehalem. Nehalem is a socket change for Intel. This article clarifies the difference between Nehalem for servers and desktops. The desktops get a "smaller" socket, and no integrated memory controller. Desktop Socket H (LGA 715) versus server Socket B (LGA 1336). The word "rumor" appears in the title (so better, more recent articles may exist elsewhere). So this could amount to an FSB change for the Intel desktop. http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/dis...815122559.html Another version of the article, here. I don't see how there is room for an integrated memory controller, with only 715 contacts. Many of those are used for power and ground for Vcore. http://www.dailytech.com/Gearing+Up+...rticle9823.htm I think the safest bet is, the socket will change, and what exactly it is, won't matter until it is released :-) I think there might be a later AMD roadmap around than this one. This one is from December 2007. AMD is working on 45nm technology, but one article I read several months ago, mentioned their 45nm approach is not a complete redesign, and more of just a shrink. That should help their profitability with what they can sell, by making the silicon die smaller. But in terms of overclocking, unless a miracle were to occur, I wouldn't expect the top clock to change so radically, as to overtake Intel. It may also help, when using companies like Chartered, to aid in volume production. http://my.ocworkbench.com/bbs/attach...1&d=1197568327 Depending on what you are doing with your computer, I think the existing, mature technology is pretty attractive. Cranking the FSB doesn't do anything, unless the thing behind the FSB is starving. AMD cannot be as forthcoming, about their future plans. On the one hand, they can display the developments that are imminent, and likely to succeed (that is called "execution" and is important to stock valuation). But for AMD to claw their way into real competition, takes a tech transition, and I'm sure there are some engineers losing sleep over that as we speak. If they cannot rely on process technology to make them competitive, then it'll have to be by architecture alone. Just a guess, Paul |
#3
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What's coming up in hardware?
"Paul" wrote in message ... TVeblen wrote: My P4 boxes are getting long in the tooth, so I'm lurking again and starting to think of new builds. Maybe this winter. The new Penryn class of processors look promising, once the price gets down to the normal range, and I'm sure there will be a lot of new mainboard specs and peripherals options once they are mainstreamed. Is AMD coming out with a competing product? So what else should I be keeping my eye on and researching for the coming months? What do you know? The next thing for Intel, is Nehalem. Nehalem is a socket change for Intel. This article clarifies the difference between Nehalem for servers and desktops. The desktops get a "smaller" socket, and no integrated memory controller. Desktop Socket H (LGA 715) versus server Socket B (LGA 1336). The word "rumor" appears in the title (so better, more recent articles may exist elsewhere). So this could amount to an FSB change for the Intel desktop. http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/dis...815122559.html Another version of the article, here. I don't see how there is room for an integrated memory controller, with only 715 contacts. Many of those are used for power and ground for Vcore. http://www.dailytech.com/Gearing+Up+...rticle9823.htm I think the safest bet is, the socket will change, and what exactly it is, won't matter until it is released :-) I think there might be a later AMD roadmap around than this one. This one is from December 2007. AMD is working on 45nm technology, but one article I read several months ago, mentioned their 45nm approach is not a complete redesign, and more of just a shrink. That should help their profitability with what they can sell, by making the silicon die smaller. But in terms of overclocking, unless a miracle were to occur, I wouldn't expect the top clock to change so radically, as to overtake Intel. It may also help, when using companies like Chartered, to aid in volume production. http://my.ocworkbench.com/bbs/attach...1&d=1197568327 Depending on what you are doing with your computer, I think the existing, mature technology is pretty attractive. Cranking the FSB doesn't do anything, unless the thing behind the FSB is starving. AMD cannot be as forthcoming, about their future plans. On the one hand, they can display the developments that are imminent, and likely to succeed (that is called "execution" and is important to stock valuation). But for AMD to claw their way into real competition, takes a tech transition, and I'm sure there are some engineers losing sleep over that as we speak. If they cannot rely on process technology to make them competitive, then it'll have to be by architecture alone. Just a guess, Paul Thanks for that info Paul. Very interesting. As I understood the article, the additional pins on the processor allow it to communicated with the northbridge. With the memory controller on the chip there is no need for that communication, so the pins can be reduced from 775 to 715. Mmm, and they will be able to have more PCI-E slots. What do we do with these? Are they making sound cards, NICs, or modems PCI-E? Curious. I am a big fan of mature technology and OS's. Never liked the idea of being the first dough-boy over the hill. Maybe with the release of the LGA715 processors and boards the 45 nm 775's will drop down into the bargain bin? |
#4
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What's coming up in hardware?
In message "TVeblen"
wrote: Mmm, and they will be able to have more PCI-E slots. What do we do with these? Are they making sound cards, NICs, or modems PCI-E? Curious. Most modern motherboards implement more of the onboard components on the PCI-E rather then on the PCI bus, my guess is that the additional PCI-E lanes are to facilitate furthering this, in combination with allowing as much bandwidth to additional PCI-E slots as possible. There aren't many PCI-E cards out there beyond video cards, although a few do exist. |
#5
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What's coming up in hardware?
"DevilsPGD" wrote in message ... In message "TVeblen" wrote: Mmm, and they will be able to have more PCI-E slots. What do we do with these? Are they making sound cards, NICs, or modems PCI-E? Curious. Most modern motherboards implement more of the onboard components on the PCI-E rather then on the PCI bus, my guess is that the additional PCI-E lanes are to facilitate furthering this, in combination with allowing as much bandwidth to additional PCI-E slots as possible. There aren't many PCI-E cards out there beyond video cards, although a few do exist. Yes, but it sounds a bit like cart before the horse. I remember when we were transitioning from ISA to PCI slots, it was done incrementally, but there were always PCI cards available when those mainboards came out. Question: are PCI-E slots backwards compatible? Could a PCI card be made to work in one? Do you think the overall transition to USB enabled devices and/or SATA connections is pushing out the use of daughter cards overall? Sort of like the push to kill off the floppy drive? |
#6
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What's coming up in hardware?
In message "TVeblen"
wrote: Yes, but it sounds a bit like cart before the horse. I remember when we were transitioning from ISA to PCI slots, it was done incrementally, but there were always PCI cards available when those mainboards came out. True -- However, with nearly everything being onboard these days, there is less of a need. Onboard sound used to be a joke, today it's all but the best option for reasonable 7.1 analog or digital output for SOHO (or anything other then high end professional needs) Oh, and there are a few PCI-E sound cards out there now; | http://www.memoryexpress.com/Product...)/Default.aspx NICs are the same, onboard gig-E is actually performing well, faster then PCI cards are even capable of doing, with 2-4 separate ethernet adapters onboard on most modern hobbyist boards. There are some nice PCI-E and PCI-X cards out there too. There are already SATA II and RAID controllers using PCI-E, which makes sense since they can use the bandwidth. You can also find serial, parallel, USB, and ExpressCard adapter cards that all support PCI-E; http://www.memoryexpress.com/Product...chPhrase=pci-e Modems are about the only card I know of anyone owning that can't be found onboard or in PCI-E these days. Question: are PCI-E slots backwards compatible? Could a PCI card be made to work in one? Not directly, although like with anything else, there are chips out there designed to ease the transition. Some of the lower bandwidth PCI-E cards (serial/parellel) were designed for PCI, and use a PCI-E converter, similar to how nearly all (if not all) the IDE/ATA drives today are really SATA drives under the hood, but with a IDE-SATA chip. (Oh, and no affiliation with MemoryExpress, they're just a local shop that I buy from regularly, and I know their stock reasonably well) |
#7
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What's coming up in hardware?
"TVeblen" wrote:
My P4 boxes are getting long in the tooth, so I'm lurking again and starting to think of new builds. Maybe this winter. The new Penryn class of processors look promising, once the price gets down to the normal range, and I'm sure there will be a lot of new mainboard specs and peripherals options once they are mainstreamed. Is AMD coming out with a competing product? So what else should I be keeping my eye on and researching for the coming months? After recently upgrading from single to dual core, I'm sure you'll be impressed with any multiple core CPU. Apparently each additional core is like 100% more gigaflops and that's what matters if there are no bottlenecks. For upgrading CPU power, this looks like a great era. -- Currently filtering out most Google Groups posts/branches. |
#8
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What's coming up in hardware?
"DevilsPGD" wrote in message ... In message "TVeblen" wrote: Yes, but it sounds a bit like cart before the horse. I remember when we were transitioning from ISA to PCI slots, it was done incrementally, but there were always PCI cards available when those mainboards came out. True -- However, with nearly everything being onboard these days, there is less of a need. Onboard sound used to be a joke, today it's all but the best option for reasonable 7.1 analog or digital output for SOHO (or anything other then high end professional needs) Oh, and there are a few PCI-E sound cards out there now; | http://www.memoryexpress.com/Product...)/Default.aspx NICs are the same, onboard gig-E is actually performing well, faster then PCI cards are even capable of doing, with 2-4 separate ethernet adapters onboard on most modern hobbyist boards. There are some nice PCI-E and PCI-X cards out there too. There are already SATA II and RAID controllers using PCI-E, which makes sense since they can use the bandwidth. You can also find serial, parallel, USB, and ExpressCard adapter cards that all support PCI-E; http://www.memoryexpress.com/Product...chPhrase=pci-e Modems are about the only card I know of anyone owning that can't be found onboard or in PCI-E these days. Question: are PCI-E slots backwards compatible? Could a PCI card be made to work in one? Not directly, although like with anything else, there are chips out there designed to ease the transition. Some of the lower bandwidth PCI-E cards (serial/parellel) were designed for PCI, and use a PCI-E converter, similar to how nearly all (if not all) the IDE/ATA drives today are really SATA drives under the hood, but with a IDE-SATA chip. Thanks for the good intel. It sounds like the transition is well underway, and since these new mainboard designs are not due to be announced until this fall I'm sure there will be even more stuff ready to go by then. So I'm going to treat the PCI slot like an ISA while I contemplate my specs. Might be good to have one or two for "legacy" devices (I've got a bag of PCI NICs). |
#9
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What's coming up in hardware?
Paul wrote:
TVeblen wrote: My P4 boxes are getting long in the tooth, so I'm lurking again and starting to think of new builds. Maybe this winter. The new Penryn class of processors look promising, once the price gets down to the normal range, and I'm sure there will be a lot of new mainboard specs and peripherals options once they are mainstreamed. Is AMD coming out with a competing product? So what else should I be keeping my eye on and researching for the coming months? What do you know? The next thing for Intel, is Nehalem. Nehalem is a socket change for Intel. This article clarifies the difference between Nehalem for servers and desktops. The desktops get a "smaller" socket, and no integrated memory controller. Desktop Socket H (LGA 715) versus server Socket B (LGA 1336). The word "rumor" appears in the title (so better, more recent articles may exist elsewhere). So this could amount to an FSB change for the Intel desktop. http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/dis...815122559.html Another version of the article, here. I don't see how there is room for an integrated memory controller, with only 715 contacts. Many of those are used for power and ground for Vcore. http://www.dailytech.com/Gearing+Up+...rticle9823.htm I think the safest bet is, the socket will change, and what exactly it is, won't matter until it is released :-) I think there might be a later AMD roadmap around than this one. This one is from December 2007. AMD is working on 45nm technology, but one article I read several months ago, mentioned their 45nm approach is not a complete redesign, and more of just a shrink. That should help their profitability with what they can sell, by making the silicon die smaller. But in terms of overclocking, unless a miracle were to occur, I wouldn't expect the top clock to change so radically, as to overtake Intel. It may also help, when using companies like Chartered, to aid in volume production. http://my.ocworkbench.com/bbs/attach...1&d=1197568327 Depending on what you are doing with your computer, I think the existing, mature technology is pretty attractive. Cranking the FSB doesn't do anything, unless the thing behind the FSB is starving. AMD cannot be as forthcoming, about their future plans. On the one hand, they can display the developments that are imminent, and likely to succeed (that is called "execution" and is important to stock valuation). But for AMD to claw their way into real competition, takes a tech transition, and I'm sure there are some engineers losing sleep over that as we speak. If they cannot rely on process technology to make them competitive, then it'll have to be by architecture alone. Just a guess, Paul Some real products are shown here, for Nehalem in desktop and server. I'd say the rumor articles weren't quite correct, but there aren't enough details in this article to be sure. It is possible, that other enthusiast sites, who sent reporters to Computex, will have more details. Like the actual pin count on the desktop socket. http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...008-great-wall Paul |
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