what to buy: 8800GT or HD3870 or 9600GT ?

Joseph wrote:

What a dumb comment. Anyone familiar with technology knows that
technology progress is not a linear function of time. Buying a top card
of the time at the right time can mean that you are close to the cutting
edge for a year or more. Buying a top card of the time at the wrong time
can see it superseded in a month - effectively wasting your money.

The new cards from nvidia are due in the next month. Given that the top
cards of the moment cannot even play current games at high resolution
(eg, Crysis), waiting a month doesn't sound like a bad idea.


I don't think the OP was focusing on the commodity aspect of cards, any
card purchased loses value the second another card comes out, high end
or low end. It's not a waste of money when you buy what you need at the
time you need it, it's an expense.

nVidia relies on the large installed base of users with all sorts of
different configurations, hoping that each time they offer a card with
incremental abilities to the market a particular segment of the PC
population will go "this card is better than my card and in my budget."

So nVidia can keep releasing 8600, 8650's and 8700's and so in in small
increments since there is a large enough segment of buyers who would
benefit from the 8850, 8900 or 8975. (Not to mention OEM's screaming for
fresh version numbers for their glossy ad copy "new!!!")

That's why buyers should not focus on the card at all, but how it
performs in the games you play at the resolutions you play in the
specific circumstances you operate under.

Vidmark wrote:

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other box,
has better quality color and crispness so,

Adjust the image characteristics of the display with the 8800GTS to suit
you tastes.


I came to the conclusion not to
touch another Nvidia video card.

Presumptive hyperbolic nonsense.


I believe ATI's video technology is by far
better and more advanced than Nvidia's.

I'm glad you believe it rather than know it, since it's better to have
false beliefs rather than false facts.

That is my 2 cents..

And worth as much.

ATI has great products, but not for any reason real or imagined that you
assert.

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other box,
has better quality color and crispness so, I came to the conclusion not to
touch another Nvidia video card. I believe ATI's video technology is by
far better and more advanced than Nvidia's. That is my 2 cents...

Kind of hard to make objective comparsons like that unless you are comparing
apples to apples. As in all other computer hardware, especially the
monitor, being identical. Even then all you're really seeing is the default
color and screen profiles set by the driver. Which can be changed at will.
I've used a a 7800GTX, and 8800GT, and an HD2400XT all on the exact same box
and LCD. I do a lot of photo work and game a fair bit. I could discern zero
difference in color fidelity and crispness in phot editing and other
graphics apps. As for the actual video technology, you must have a very
short memory or don't do a great deal of reading about what ATI has been
producing lately. The 3850/3870 series is the first decent hardware thing
they've made since the X1900 series.

"Vidmark" wrote in message
...

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other box,
has better quality color and crispness so, I came to the conclusion not to
touch another Nvidia video card. I believe ATI's video technology is by
far better and more advanced than Nvidia's. That is my 2 cents...


**Fanboy Alert** - Ignore

"CJM" wrote in message
...

"Vidmark" wrote in message
...

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other box,
has better quality color and crispness so, I came to the conclusion not
to touch another Nvidia video card. I believe ATI's video technology is
by far better and more advanced than Nvidia's. That is my 2 cents...


**Fanboy Alert** - Ignore

Who's the bigger "fanboy", the fanboy or the fanboy who shouts "**Fanboy
Alert**" first?

For all anyone (including you) knows, he is speaking from pure experience
and has no brand bias. His conclusion being incorrect does not make him a
fanboy either.

Tony

Yea, so is 10xxx and 11xxx. And 4870 or whatever ATI will call their
next card.

Nvidia 9xxx is coming in these few months. 9600GT is out now.

What about your 10xxx and 11xxx?

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On Feb 25, 1:07*pm, "Tony DiMarzio" wrote:
"CJM" wrote in message

...



"Vidmark" wrote in message
.. .

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other box,
has better quality color and crispness so, I came to the conclusion not
to touch another Nvidia video card. I believe ATI's video technology is
by far better and more advanced than Nvidia's. That is my 2 cents...

**Fanboy Alert** - Ignore

Who's the bigger "fanboy", the fanboy or the fanboy who shouts "**Fanboy
Alert**" first?

For all anyone (including you) knows, he is speaking from pure experience
and has no brand bias. His conclusion being incorrect does not make him a
fanboy either.

Sooo... does 3870 provide better image quality ? In any of the
departments ? (I read numerous articles on the Internet where it was
shown with arguments that ATI 2XXX/3XXX has a better image quality
than 8800GT and its ilk, and other articles which dismissed it with
believable arguments, too.

My 7600GT + LG194WT combo provides severe banding/dithering/
posterisation, like the one mentioned in http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=35500
. I thought going to the ATI camp (3870) will inmprove the quality of
image, that is the banding problem will disappear (or, at least, will
be seriously mitigated).

"Beladi Nasrallah" wrote in message
...
So, I decided to buy a new videocard. Presently, I have an nVidia
7600GT. It plays a lot, if not most of the games of the past 2 years
at the settings close to maximum. But I wanted to be able to play
Crysis and the like.

I was thinking about nVidia 8800GT. However, its length is 23 cm, and
the available space in my PC case is 22 cm. So, no 8800GT... maybe,
the Gigabyte version with the Zalman cooler and the non-reference PCB
which is 21 cm long.

The alternative is ATI HD3870. "Triplex" from Taiwan released the 3870
card with a non-reference PCB which has a length of 19 cm, and thus
will fit my case. Those cards were sold exclusively in China, but
started to pop up in the USA, Australia and Germany as seen on eBay.

I was contemplating by such a card from eBay, but the price in here is
still high (~ US$250) even inspite the advertised decrease of the
price of the card by AMD from US$250 to $190.

This decrease was inspired by the announcement of 9600GT by nVidia. It
perfroms almost as good as HD3870, but costs $170. I think I like the
idea of 9600GT more... but this card is long ! -- I cannot fit it into
my case -- it is as long as the reference 8800GT.

I did an extensive reading on the INternet, and it came out why the
performance of 9600GT is as good as that of HD3870 even if it has a
less powerful hardware. The first reason is that nVidia optimised
their hardware for fps performance in gaming. Secondly, the RV670 chip
in HD3870 has a flaw: it has a software implementation of anti-
aliasing (which I need for SH4) instead of hardware one. Moreover, the
AA is via the so-called "tent" function, which just averages over the
neighborhood, and thus makes the sharp details look muddy. You do not
always need that ! What's more (and very serious), nVidia seems to
come up often with the updated drivers for the latest games; ATI is
not doing it, and it is not known whether they will provide such a
support after being acquised by AMD.

In short, I could wait for half a year more, and probably buy an
HD3870 for $160-190. Or, I could wait the same half a year, and
possibly buy 9600GT for $150-170 (and a new case, or wait for a
shorter non-reference PCB design ?). Or, I could buy right now the
grey-import HD3870 (from China tailored for the Chinese market with
the Chinese quality) for $260. What do you think guys ?


Short answer is - it depends on your budget - either the 9600GT or the
8800GT if you
can afford it. Take into account a 8800GT will need a more powerful PSU and
I'm guessing
with a 7600GT you havent got a really beefy PSU.

Avoid *Triplex* if you can - I tried their X1950Pro last year and 2 cards
were both faulty due to inadequate cooling.
They're a cheap brand and you get what you pay for.

I since got a 3850 and although its a decent performer the fan doesnt run
quick enough and the card runs at 90c or higher
when gaming. This is a common problem among 3850/3870 cards and if you're
unlucky enough to get a bad one it'll need a
bios update - or 3rd party fan - or running Rivatuner to force a higher fan
speed.

I've got a AMD X2 CPU and the HD3850 (so Im no nvidia fanboy) but Im
thinking hard about ditching the 3850 for a 9600GT.

"Tony DiMarzio" wrote in message
. ..
"CJM" wrote in message
...

"Vidmark" wrote in message
...

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other
box, has better quality color and crispness so, I came to the conclusion
not to touch another Nvidia video card. I believe ATI's video technology
is by far better and more advanced than Nvidia's. That is my 2 cents...


**Fanboy Alert** - Ignore

Who's the bigger "fanboy", the fanboy or the fanboy who shouts "**Fanboy
Alert**" first?

How am I a fanboy? I have professed no bias to *any* manufacturer, therefore
if I am a fanboy, I am a closet fanboy.

This guy *is* a fanboy because he is using a subjective (and dare I say,
********) argument to compare to two systems which aren't really comparable.
His 'I believe' and 'my 2 cents' quotes demonstrate that this is merely
opinion, and the lack of any indication why ATI's technology is better than
Nvidia's demonstrates that it is an unsubstantive opinion at that.


As another poster has pointed out, colour palettes can be configured to
taste in a number of different ways. In addition, colour perception is more
than likely dictated by monitor settings anyway. As for crispness, would
have I thought that Nvidia (currently) superior AA technology would have had
a massive say on that argument.

Besides, if he genuinely rates ATI so highly, why does he have an 8800GTS?

There is rarely much of a difference between the latest ATI technology and
the latest Nvidia technology. One company leads the way for a while then the
other takes over. The more noticable differences are framerate and price.
Currently, Nvidia wins on both.

Had he compared an 9600 with an FX5700 and I would have had some sympathy.


For all anyone (including you) knows, he is speaking from pure experience
and has no brand bias.

If he spoke from any kind of experience, perhaps he wouldn't be labelled a
fanboy. But to claim ATI is better than Nvidia because he likes the colour
palette of his 5 year old R9600 compared to his 1yr old 8800GTS is pure
folly; if he's not a fanboy then he's a fool.

In article , "Tony DiMarzio" wrote:
"CJM" wrote in message
...

"Vidmark" wrote in message
...

I currently use a PCI-e Nvidia 8800GTS. My ATI 9600 AGP in the other box,
has better quality color and crispness so, I came to the conclusion not
to touch another Nvidia video card. I believe ATI's video technology is
by far better and more advanced than Nvidia's. That is my 2 cents...


**Fanboy Alert** - Ignore

Who's the bigger "fanboy", the fanboy or the fanboy who shouts "**Fanboy
Alert**" first?

For all anyone (including you) knows, he is speaking from pure experience
and has no brand bias. His conclusion being incorrect does not make him a
fanboy either.

Tony


If he truely had experience, he would have know that there is a digital vibrance setting you can adjust in the Nvidia control panel!

I came from years of ATI cards, but found the 8800GTS to be much better than
my older ATI cards like the X1650 series or the 9800Pro i had before