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nvidia AGP on Dell XPS-T



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 3rd 03, 04:59 PM
J.Clarke
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sun, 03 Aug 2003 16:03:30 GMT
"oodler" wrote:

went ahead and purchased an Nvidia GEForce2 MX-400 for my semi-old
system. The problem became, once the card arrived, I
realized it wasn't the right _type_ of AGP card; apparently, cards
made for newer AGP slots in newer computers won't physically fit in
slots from 1999 motherboards; it has somethiing to do with the way
different "speeds" of AGP card are manufactured- something about how
cards made for 4x won't physically fit in 1 or 2x slots. I only read
this warning after purchasing the card.

When I angrily Returned To Sender the item and asked www.tcwo.com to
send me a compatible card, they informed me that "the age of your
motherboard is the issue" and that there was nothing they could do
except recredit my account and let that be the end of it.

I'm forced to accept their decision but I still think it's bull****. I
know several people with computers two or three years older than mine
who are able to use Nvidia AGP cards. So it boggles my mind that TCWO
would not have the proper type of AGP card in stock.

I've got a Dell XPS-T600. And no, I'm not getting rid of
it and getting a new box; thanks anyway in advance. According to the
Belarc System Profile Advisor, my motherboard's an Intel SE440BX-3
AA722396-108.


What's the proper "speed" of GeForce2 MX-400 to get for my computer?


Did you try to put the board in? If so, what didn't fit--was the
connector too long, shifted to the front or back, the crosspieces in the
connector didn't match the cutouts in the board, something was sticking
up blocking the skirt in front, what?

I've got a (dead--I have no idea why I put it in the attic instead of
tossing it) SE440BX sitting here in front of me right now and every
video board I have fits right into the slot.

As for boards fitting into slots, a board that is 2x-only will not fit
into a slot that is 4x-only, but any non-PCI GF2MX400 should support
both 2 and 4 and fit either slot.

Instead of tcwo, go over to http://www.newegg.com and look at the boards
and find one that has a connector that looks like the one on your
existing board--count contacts if you have to. When you find a matching
board, if there is something special about it there should be some
indication in the product description. An extra cutout in the connector
is OK, as is an additional skirt with no contacts on the end away from
the card bracket, but the connector should be the same length (in terms
of number of contacts) and the slot toward the card bracket end should
be the same number of contacts from the end.

Thanks



--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
  #2  
Old August 3rd 03, 05:03 PM
oodler
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default nvidia AGP on Dell XPS-T

went ahead and purchased an Nvidia GEForce2 MX-400 for my semi-old system.
The problem became, once the card arrived, I
realized it wasn't the right _type_ of AGP card; apparently, cards made for
newer AGP slots in newer computers won't physically fit in slots from 1999
motherboards; it has somethiing to do with the way different "speeds" of AGP
card are manufactured- something about how cards made for 4x won't
physically fit in 1 or 2x slots. I only read this warning after purchasing
the card.

When I angrily Returned To Sender the item and asked www.tcwo.com to send me
a compatible card, they informed me that "the age of your motherboard is the
issue" and that there was nothing they could do except recredit my account
and let that be the end of it.

I'm forced to accept their decision but I still think it's bull****. I know
several people with computers two or three years older than mine who are
able to use Nvidia AGP cards. So it boggles my mind that TCWO would not have
the proper type of AGP card in stock.

I've got a Dell XPS-T600. And no, I'm not getting rid of
it and getting a new box; thanks anyway in advance. According to the Belarc
System Profile Advisor, my motherboard's an Intel SE440BX-3 AA722396-108.


What's the proper "speed" of GeForce2 MX-400 to get for my computer?

Thanks


  #3  
Old August 3rd 03, 11:51 PM
Dave
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"oodler" wrote in message
...
went ahead and purchased an Nvidia GEForce2 MX-400 for my semi-old system.
The problem became, once the card arrived, I
realized it wasn't the right _type_ of AGP card; apparently, cards made

for
newer AGP slots in newer computers won't physically fit in slots from 1999
motherboards; it has somethiing to do with the way different "speeds" of

AGP
card are manufactured- something about how cards made for 4x won't
physically fit in 1 or 2x slots.


You wouldn't wanna put it into a 1x slot, but the BX chipset on your mobo
supports 2x AGP 2.0. So if the AGP slot is there, that card would
undoubtedly work. No question.

I only read this warning after purchasing
the card.


The slot was short 'n' brown, right, not short 'n' white or long 'n' black,
right? ;-) FFS, even the Radeon 9700 (supposedly not the 9800 tho...) works
in a 2x AGP 2.0 slot (might have something to do with the external power
connector, yathink?)! I installed a NP in a BX board for someone not too
long ago (believe me, I tried to get him to return it for a certain Sapphire
9500 NP, it was serious overkill...), and it actually worked with a 300-watt
power supply, go figure! All MX's I've ever seen have two cutouts on the AGP
connector. This is so they'll fit in 4x (and 4x/8x)-only slots as well as 2x
(and 4x/2x). The vast majority of 4x video cards out there are
backwards-compatible with 2x (SOL on the LX and other 1x boards); a few
(such as some GF4s) like a little more power than is normally fed to the AGP
slot on some older mobos. The MX2s even work with some Socket 7 mobos (MVP3
northbridge, not so well with the VP3 or ALI boards) in AGP mode with
drivers below 6.31 (using Detonator 6.18's, which is the last really stable
set before AGP functions with Super 7 chipsets were given the heave-ho...).
At that time the BX was about the best chipset avaliable. Well, didja try
the damn card in the slot? Tell the truth...

When I angrily Returned To Sender the item and asked www.tcwo.com to send

me
a compatible card, they informed me that "the age of your motherboard is

the
issue" and that there was nothing they could do except recredit my account
and let that be the end of it.


So they gave you Pat Answer #65 and made good on their end? I don't see
anything wrong here...

I'm forced to accept their decision but I still think it's bull****.


Yes it is. That card would have worked in there, provided there even was an
AGP slot, and you didn't have to return it. That's where the bull****
starts.

I know
several people with computers two or three years older than mine who are
able to use Nvidia AGP cards. So it boggles my mind that TCWO would not

have
the proper type of AGP card in stock.


Not their fault someone didn't figure out the hardware in question. Who made
the order? Whaddyamean it doesn't work? I do this sort of thing all the
frickin' time!
All together now: "God didn't do that, man! YOU did!"

I've got a Dell XPS-T600. And no, I'm not getting rid of
it and getting a new box; thanks anyway in advance. According to the

Belarc
System Profile Advisor, my motherboard's an Intel SE440BX-3 AA722396-108.


The only way that card would not work in there is if there was the typical
onboard video (usually ATI Rage Pro) and NO AGP SLOT. In that case, youse
gets a PCI FX5200 or MX4 and lives with it. Just remember to set the damn
thing to boot with PCI video before installing the card, please...no need
for another RMA based on lack of information...

What's the proper "speed" of GeForce2 MX-400 to get for my computer?


GF3 Ti-200, GF3 plain, GF3 Ti-500, older GF4 64-meg (unless there's an
under-$100 128-megger TBF), Radeon 7500 (much better than the MX card even
if equally dated), Radeon 8500 LE thru 9100 (best choice). Or even a 64-meg
MX4 440 SE 128-bit for under $50. I wouldn't waste my time with the MX2,
even with a 600 MHz box. Just make sure it says something about AGP 2x
compatibility in the manufacturer's specs and you're pretty much good to
go...

BTW, a $20 Upgradeware Slot T card (www.strattoncomputer.com) and $50
Tualatin Celeron 1400 will fit right in there, the (latest) BIOS will ID it
as a Pentium Pro, but it will work just fine in Windows. Been going thru a
lot of these Upgradeware slockets lately. Then the GF3 will be a halfway
decent companion...


  #4  
Old August 4th 03, 02:21 AM
J.Clarke
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sun, 03 Aug 2003 22:17:02 GMT
"oodler" wrote:


"J.Clarke" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 03 Aug 2003 16:03:30 GMT
Did you try to put the board in? If so, what didn't fit--was the
connector too long, shifted to the front or back, the crosspieces in
the connector didn't match the cutouts in the board, something was
sticking up blocking the skirt in front, what?


It's bevelled wrong. At least I think the word is bevelled, but what
I'm referring to sounds like what you referred to as "crosspieces in
the connector"- that is, the spaces in between the electronic contacts
on the bottom of the card didn't match the AGP slot properly like my
3dfx card does. The very fact that the two are bevelled differently
set off an alarm in my head that tcwo may have sent me the wrong card,
but they refused to help me further when I returned it to them- which,
eh, Ped me the FO.

But anyway, does this give you any clearer an explanation of the
problem? I ran across a part of tcwo's help section that seemed to
give an idea of what went wrong in my case, but I didn't know what to
do with it exactly so I came here instead.
http://support.tcwo.com/detail.cfm?uniqueID=81


All that seems to say is that AGP 2X boards won't physically fit into
AGP 4x-only motherboards. That should not be an issue with the products
you mention.

I'm not really clear on what you mean by "bevel"--to me a bevel is
simply a relieved edge.

Thanks again

I've got a (dead--I have no idea why I put it in the attic instead
of tossing it) SE440BX sitting here in front of me right now and
every video board I have fits right into the slot.

As for boards fitting into slots, a board that is 2x-only will not
fit into a slot that is 4x-only, but any non-PCI GF2MX400 should
support both 2 and 4 and fit either slot.

Instead of tcwo, go over to http://www.newegg.com and look at the
boards and find one that has a connector that looks like the one on
your existing board--count contacts if you have to. When you find a
matching board, if there is something special about it there should
be some indication in the product description. An extra cutout in
the connector is OK, as is an additional skirt with no contacts on
the end away from the card bracket, but the connector should be the
same length (in terms of number of contacts) and the slot toward the
card bracket end should be the same number of contacts from the end.

Thanks



--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)





--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
  #5  
Old August 4th 03, 02:21 AM
Robert Hancock
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Nothing to do with 4X vs. 2X, it's the difference in AGP I/O voltage. That
motherboard only supports 3.3V I/O, and it seems that the card you bought
only supports 1.5V I/O, which explains why the slot pattern prevents you
inserting it. However, I have never seen such a card that only supported
1.5V myself..

If, on the other hand, you're talking about that L-shaped part that sticks
out past the end of the AGP slot, it's supposed to be that way unless the
motherboard has a retention-clip part to grab that part of the card.

--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from
Home Page:
http://www.roberthancock.com/


"oodler" wrote in message
...
went ahead and purchased an Nvidia GEForce2 MX-400 for my semi-old system.
The problem became, once the card arrived, I
realized it wasn't the right _type_ of AGP card; apparently, cards made

for
newer AGP slots in newer computers won't physically fit in slots from 1999
motherboards; it has somethiing to do with the way different "speeds" of

AGP
card are manufactured- something about how cards made for 4x won't
physically fit in 1 or 2x slots. I only read this warning after purchasing
the card.

When I angrily Returned To Sender the item and asked www.tcwo.com to send

me
a compatible card, they informed me that "the age of your motherboard is

the
issue" and that there was nothing they could do except recredit my account
and let that be the end of it.

I'm forced to accept their decision but I still think it's bull****. I

know
several people with computers two or three years older than mine who are
able to use Nvidia AGP cards. So it boggles my mind that TCWO would not

have
the proper type of AGP card in stock.

I've got a Dell XPS-T600. And no, I'm not getting rid of
it and getting a new box; thanks anyway in advance. According to the

Belarc
System Profile Advisor, my motherboard's an Intel SE440BX-3 AA722396-108.


What's the proper "speed" of GeForce2 MX-400 to get for my computer?

Thanks




  #6  
Old August 4th 03, 02:48 AM
Dave
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Robert Hancock" wrote in message
. ca...
Nothing to do with 4X vs. 2X, it's the difference in AGP I/O voltage. That
motherboard only supports 3.3V I/O, and it seems that the card you bought
only supports 1.5V I/O, which explains why the slot pattern prevents you
inserting it. However, I have never seen such a card that only supported
1.5V myself..


A 4x-only GF2??? Didn't know that animal existed...they woulda been shooting
themselves in the foot a little there. If it was a 4x-only part, it would
have only one divot in the edge connector toward the back of the card, away
from the bracket, so that it would only work in 1.5v signalling-only mobos
such as the I850. You can't even put a 2x-only (3.3v required) card in that
slot. If the card in question is the only one of its kind listed on TCWO's
site, it doesn't mention 2x compatibility, but the picture is clearly that
of a 2x-compatible card...


If, on the other hand, you're talking about that L-shaped part that sticks
out past the end of the AGP slot, it's supposed to be that way unless the
motherboard has a retention-clip part to grab that part of the card.

--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from
Home Page:
http://www.roberthancock.com/


snip



  #7  
Old August 4th 03, 06:18 AM
oodler
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Uh.. guys? You're losing me a little here with all the techie talk.

Thought I should letcha know.

"Dave" wrote in message
news:EXiXa.58626$o%[email protected]

"Robert Hancock" wrote in message
. ca...
Nothing to do with 4X vs. 2X, it's the difference in AGP I/O voltage.

That
motherboard only supports 3.3V I/O, and it seems that the card you

bought
only supports 1.5V I/O, which explains why the slot pattern prevents you
inserting it. However, I have never seen such a card that only supported
1.5V myself..


A 4x-only GF2??? Didn't know that animal existed...they woulda been

shooting
themselves in the foot a little there. If it was a 4x-only part, it would
have only one divot in the edge connector toward the back of the card,

away
from the bracket, so that it would only work in 1.5v signalling-only mobos
such as the I850. You can't even put a 2x-only (3.3v required) card in

that
slot. If the card in question is the only one of its kind listed on TCWO's
site, it doesn't mention 2x compatibility, but the picture is clearly

that
of a 2x-compatible card...


If, on the other hand, you're talking about that L-shaped part that

sticks
out past the end of the AGP slot, it's supposed to be that way unless

the
motherboard has a retention-clip part to grab that part of the card.

--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from
Home Page:
http://www.roberthancock.com/


snip





  #8  
Old August 4th 03, 06:36 AM
oodler
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

You're not helping me by telling me this is my fault. I didn't come to be
ridiculed for making a mistake; I came here to learn how to rectify it.
"Dave" wrote in message
news[email protected]

"oodler" wrote in message
...
went ahead and purchased an Nvidia GEForce2 MX-400 for my semi-old

system.
The problem became, once the card arrived, I
realized it wasn't the right _type_ of AGP card; apparently, cards made

for
newer AGP slots in newer computers won't physically fit in slots from

1999
motherboards; it has somethiing to do with the way different "speeds" of

AGP
card are manufactured- something about how cards made for 4x won't
physically fit in 1 or 2x slots.


You wouldn't wanna put it into a 1x slot, but the BX chipset on your mobo
supports 2x AGP 2.0. So if the AGP slot is there, that card would
undoubtedly work. No question.

I only read this warning after purchasing
the card.


The slot was short 'n' brown, right, not short 'n' white or long 'n'

black,
right? ;-) FFS, even the Radeon 9700 (supposedly not the 9800 tho...)

works
in a 2x AGP 2.0 slot (might have something to do with the external power
connector, yathink?)! I installed a NP in a BX board for someone not too
long ago (believe me, I tried to get him to return it for a certain

Sapphire
9500 NP, it was serious overkill...), and it actually worked with a

300-watt
power supply, go figure! All MX's I've ever seen have two cutouts on the

AGP
connector. This is so they'll fit in 4x (and 4x/8x)-only slots as well as

2x
(and 4x/2x). The vast majority of 4x video cards out there are
backwards-compatible with 2x (SOL on the LX and other 1x boards); a few
(such as some GF4s) like a little more power than is normally fed to the

AGP
slot on some older mobos. The MX2s even work with some Socket 7 mobos

(MVP3
northbridge, not so well with the VP3 or ALI boards) in AGP mode with
drivers below 6.31 (using Detonator 6.18's, which is the last really

stable
set before AGP functions with Super 7 chipsets were given the

heave-ho...).
At that time the BX was about the best chipset avaliable. Well, didja try
the damn card in the slot? Tell the truth...

When I angrily Returned To Sender the item and asked www.tcwo.com to

send
me
a compatible card, they informed me that "the age of your motherboard is

the
issue" and that there was nothing they could do except recredit my

account
and let that be the end of it.


So they gave you Pat Answer #65 and made good on their end? I don't see
anything wrong here...

I'm forced to accept their decision but I still think it's bull****.


Yes it is. That card would have worked in there, provided there even was

an
AGP slot, and you didn't have to return it. That's where the bull****
starts.

I know
several people with computers two or three years older than mine who are
able to use Nvidia AGP cards. So it boggles my mind that TCWO would not

have
the proper type of AGP card in stock.


Not their fault someone didn't figure out the hardware in question. Who

made
the order? Whaddyamean it doesn't work? I do this sort of thing all the
frickin' time!
All together now: "God didn't do that, man! YOU did!"

I've got a Dell XPS-T600. And no, I'm not getting rid of
it and getting a new box; thanks anyway in advance. According to the

Belarc
System Profile Advisor, my motherboard's an Intel SE440BX-3

AA722396-108.

The only way that card would not work in there is if there was the typical
onboard video (usually ATI Rage Pro) and NO AGP SLOT. In that case, youse
gets a PCI FX5200 or MX4 and lives with it. Just remember to set the damn
thing to boot with PCI video before installing the card, please...no need
for another RMA based on lack of information...

What's the proper "speed" of GeForce2 MX-400 to get for my computer?


GF3 Ti-200, GF3 plain, GF3 Ti-500, older GF4 64-meg (unless there's an
under-$100 128-megger TBF), Radeon 7500 (much better than the MX card even
if equally dated), Radeon 8500 LE thru 9100 (best choice). Or even a

64-meg
MX4 440 SE 128-bit for under $50. I wouldn't waste my time with the MX2,
even with a 600 MHz box. Just make sure it says something about AGP 2x
compatibility in the manufacturer's specs and you're pretty much good to
go...

BTW, a $20 Upgradeware Slot T card (www.strattoncomputer.com) and $50
Tualatin Celeron 1400 will fit right in there, the (latest) BIOS will ID

it
as a Pentium Pro, but it will work just fine in Windows. Been going thru a
lot of these Upgradeware slockets lately. Then the GF3 will be a halfway
decent companion...




  #9  
Old August 4th 03, 06:40 AM
oodler
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Too many choices is as bad as too few. I planned for a modest upgrade and
received advice for the GF2 MX-400 as a solid card for under $50. I still
think it can work, as long as I get the right AGP type for my motherboard.

"Dave" wrote in message
news[email protected]

"oodler" wrote in message
...
went ahead and purchased an Nvidia GEForce2 MX-400 for my semi-old

system.
The problem became, once the card arrived, I
realized it wasn't the right _type_ of AGP card; apparently, cards made

for
newer AGP slots in newer computers won't physically fit in slots from

1999
motherboards; it has somethiing to do with the way different "speeds" of

AGP
card are manufactured- something about how cards made for 4x won't
physically fit in 1 or 2x slots.


You wouldn't wanna put it into a 1x slot, but the BX chipset on your mobo
supports 2x AGP 2.0. So if the AGP slot is there, that card would
undoubtedly work. No question.

I only read this warning after purchasing
the card.


The slot was short 'n' brown, right, not short 'n' white or long 'n'

black,
right? ;-) FFS, even the Radeon 9700 (supposedly not the 9800 tho...)

works
in a 2x AGP 2.0 slot (might have something to do with the external power
connector, yathink?)! I installed a NP in a BX board for someone not too
long ago (believe me, I tried to get him to return it for a certain

Sapphire
9500 NP, it was serious overkill...), and it actually worked with a

300-watt
power supply, go figure! All MX's I've ever seen have two cutouts on the

AGP
connector. This is so they'll fit in 4x (and 4x/8x)-only slots as well as

2x
(and 4x/2x). The vast majority of 4x video cards out there are
backwards-compatible with 2x (SOL on the LX and other 1x boards); a few
(such as some GF4s) like a little more power than is normally fed to the

AGP
slot on some older mobos. The MX2s even work with some Socket 7 mobos

(MVP3
northbridge, not so well with the VP3 or ALI boards) in AGP mode with
drivers below 6.31 (using Detonator 6.18's, which is the last really

stable
set before AGP functions with Super 7 chipsets were given the

heave-ho...).
At that time the BX was about the best chipset avaliable. Well, didja try
the damn card in the slot? Tell the truth...

When I angrily Returned To Sender the item and asked www.tcwo.com to

send
me
a compatible card, they informed me that "the age of your motherboard is

the
issue" and that there was nothing they could do except recredit my

account
and let that be the end of it.


So they gave you Pat Answer #65 and made good on their end? I don't see
anything wrong here...

I'm forced to accept their decision but I still think it's bull****.


Yes it is. That card would have worked in there, provided there even was

an
AGP slot, and you didn't have to return it. That's where the bull****
starts.

I know
several people with computers two or three years older than mine who are
able to use Nvidia AGP cards. So it boggles my mind that TCWO would not

have
the proper type of AGP card in stock.


Not their fault someone didn't figure out the hardware in question. Who

made
the order? Whaddyamean it doesn't work? I do this sort of thing all the
frickin' time!
All together now: "God didn't do that, man! YOU did!"

I've got a Dell XPS-T600. And no, I'm not getting rid of
it and getting a new box; thanks anyway in advance. According to the

Belarc
System Profile Advisor, my motherboard's an Intel SE440BX-3

AA722396-108.

The only way that card would not work in there is if there was the typical
onboard video (usually ATI Rage Pro) and NO AGP SLOT. In that case, youse
gets a PCI FX5200 or MX4 and lives with it. Just remember to set the damn
thing to boot with PCI video before installing the card, please...no need
for another RMA based on lack of information...

What's the proper "speed" of GeForce2 MX-400 to get for my computer?


GF3 Ti-200, GF3 plain, GF3 Ti-500, older GF4 64-meg (unless there's an
under-$100 128-megger TBF), Radeon 7500 (much better than the MX card even
if equally dated), Radeon 8500 LE thru 9100 (best choice). Or even a

64-meg
MX4 440 SE 128-bit for under $50. I wouldn't waste my time with the MX2,
even with a 600 MHz box. Just make sure it says something about AGP 2x
compatibility in the manufacturer's specs and you're pretty much good to
go...

BTW, a $20 Upgradeware Slot T card (www.strattoncomputer.com) and $50
Tualatin Celeron 1400 will fit right in there, the (latest) BIOS will ID

it
as a Pentium Pro, but it will work just fine in Windows. Been going thru a
lot of these Upgradeware slockets lately. Then the GF3 will be a halfway
decent companion...




  #10  
Old August 4th 03, 08:18 AM
oodler
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"J.Clarke" wrote in message
...
All that seems to say is that AGP 2X boards won't physically fit into
AGP 4x-only motherboards. That should not be an issue with the products
you mention.

I'm not really clear on what you mean by "bevel"--to me a bevel is
simply a relieved edge.


Forget about the 'bevel' issue- it's really not important. I've gotten
advice on this issue ranging from things like "[your] motherboard only
supports 3.3V I/O, and it seems that the card you bought only supports 1.5V
I/O, which explains why the slot pattern prevents you inserting it," to
assholes who just want to poke fun at me for making a purchasing mistake and
have no intention of truly helping me with my problem.

I'm looking for something in between- advice simple and direct, but not
baby-talk. All I'm looking for is the proper type of Nvidia GF2 MX-400 AGP
to fit in the AGP slot of my Dell XPS-T600. Really, that's all. Really. Am I
missing something here in thinking it's not fundamentally more complicated
than that?


 




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