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#1
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8KNXP O/C issues (AGP voltage and more)
I have recently upgraded my system. Pertinent components a
Gigabyte GA-8KNXP ver. 2.0 w/FH BIOS Intel P4 2.8C CPU w/Thermalright SP-94 heatsink and 90mm Panaflo fan 1GB (2x512) Super Talent PC4000 (DDR500) memory nVidia GeForce2 GTS graphics card (obviously not upgraded yet) Adaptec 29160 U160 SCSI adapter (for hard drives) BIOS Settings: CPU Host Frequency - 240.5MHz (962.2 FSB; 3.3677 GHz) Memory Freq. Formula - 2.0 (which means the memory and the CPU are synchronous ... 1:1) RAM - SPD settings (3-4-4-8) Delayed Transaction - Enabled PSB Parking - Enabled Command Per Clock - Auto [disabled] Fast Chip Select - Enabled Dynamic Paging Mode - Auto [disabled] Top Performance - Not enabled RAM Voltage Control - +0.1v [net 2.6v, the specified value for the RAM modules] AGP Voltage Control - +0.3v CPU Voltage Control - 1.5875v Power Supply: +3.3 rail yields 3.44 +5.0 rail yields 4.96 +12.0 rail yields 12.22 According to MBM, the power values stay constant (there is some variation, but not much). The system is stable (actually rock stable). The SP-94 heatsink is awesome (45C max with Prime 95 ... starting at a base temp of 32C); the CPU has definitely not reached it's overclock limit yet. The issue I have is with RAM. When I put the system together (I put the new MB into an existing system ... of course changing the chipset drivers, etc), it was unstable. Windows XP Pro would randomly crash (spontaneous reboot, not BSOD). After *much* experimentation (and sending one of the RAM modules back to the mfr. to be tested; it was fine), I determined that I could get stability by increasing the AGP voltage ... and the higher I set the AGP voltage, the more I could overclock. The RAM voltage is at stock (and anything higher causes memory errors on MemTest86 and MS WINDIAG); nothing spectacular about the CPU voltage (which so far has had no effect on overclocking, since I haven't pushed the CPU to its limit). Granted, 962.2 FSB with 1:1 isn't bad, but I think it can do better (or at least the CPU can). The memory should be able to reach a minimum of 1000FSB ... at least that is the spec. My surprise here is that *AGP* voltage has been the key to overclocking. Anyone know why? I know that the AGP card is tied to memory by virtue of AGP Aperture. I haven't played with any of the overclock settings for the video card (via the nVidia drivers). My next upgrade item is a video card (MSI FX 5900XT) ... don't know whether that will affect my ability to overclock. Unfortunately, I can't turn the AGP voltage up any higher (it is at the max ... +.3), so unless I can solve the AGP issue, I'm at the end of the line. Comments? Thanks |
#2
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I think you have more to gain with a more aggressive memory setting than
eeking out that last 100mhz of cpu speed. I'm at 240 also but my mem settings are 2.5 3, 3, 6. I don't know why the increase in voltage to the agp slot makes your system stable. I'm at stock voltage except for cpu (same as yours)and I'm rock solid as well. Maybe it's the GTS card somehow? I'm running a 9800pro. Thanks for the report on the HSF, the stock cooler on my 2.8 had done a great job, but it's time for an SP94 I see...my temps are MUCH higher than yours:-) Don "Squeeky" wrote in message ... I have recently upgraded my system. Pertinent components a |
#3
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Don,
Thanks for your response. Certainly, the conventional wisdom and practice was to spend a lot of time tweaking memory timings. However, see the following article from Tom's Hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com/firstloo...105/index.html). It (and other articles I have read) suggest greater improvement from increasing the FSB than from tweaking the timings. To get 100MHz of additional CPU speed (the number you mentioned), the FSB must go up by 25 ... this will do more for performance than any possible fine-tuning of the timings. [Of course, if you can't raise the FSB any further, THEN you can fine-tune the timings.] Why did you stop at 240? What wall did you hit? Out of curiosity, what RAM are you using? As for the SP-94 ... I can't say enough. As I began writing this, I was using a CPU intensive program (100% for 30 minutes); most of the time the temp was 44C ... at one point it hit 45C. Am also using Arctic Silver II (not the latest or greatest, but it is what I happen to have in my toolbox). CPU heat is simply not a concern at the moment. [The best pricing is at http://www.svc.com ; San Jose, CA] * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 07:41:49 -0400, "M-Tech" wrote: I think you have more to gain with a more aggressive memory setting than eeking out that last 100mhz of cpu speed. I'm at 240 also but my mem settings are 2.5 3, 3, 6. I don't know why the increase in voltage to the agp slot makes your system stable. I'm at stock voltage except for cpu (same as yours)and I'm rock solid as well. Maybe it's the GTS card somehow? I'm running a 9800pro. Thanks for the report on the HSF, the stock cooler on my 2.8 had done a great job, but it's time for an SP94 I see...my temps are MUCH higher than yours:-) Don |
#4
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I'd like to know a little more about the Thermalright SP-94 heatsink and
90mm Panaflo fan. If accurate, your temperature readings are very impressive. My CPU temps typically run from 38-58 degrees C. Were you able to install the heatsink without removing the DSP2 daughter board or the DSP2 fan? What about the northbridge fan? Any mounting problems there? Also, how quiet is this setup? My stock Intel fan seems to make a lot of racket! I've never been interested in over clocking and have stuck with most of the default BIOS settings in order to maximize stability and reliability. Even so, I've found this board to be a little flakey. When I first set it up I experienced persistent cold boot problems. Sometimes it would start up and run great. Then it would freeze up on start up and I'd have to re-boot once or twice to get it going. Occasionally, when it did start up, it would act very sluggish and task manager would show near maximum CPU usage with no applications running! Installed a high performance power supply but saw no improvement. I finally discovered that by turning off "Delayed Transaction" in the BIOS, all these problems went away. "D.T. Enabled" is one of the "Fail Safe Default" settings so I over looked this possibility for a long time. Lately I've noticed a new intermittent problem. Sometimes when I boot up or bring the machine out of hibernation, I hear a fast clicking noise that sounds like an impending bearing failure in one of the case fans. The noise, however, comes from one or the other of the Plextor DVD drives. When this happens, the drive becomes unresponsive and the PC runs at a snails pace. Re-booting does not solve the problem! I have to turn it off completely and restart to get things up and running again. If anyone has any thoughts on this problem I'd like to hear from you! -- Giga-Byte GA-8KNXP v.2.0 Motherboard w/ Award BIOS v. FH Pentium 4 2.8 w/800 MHz FSB Intel 875P Chipset 1GB Kingston HyperX PC3500 (@ 2.6v) 2 Western Digital 120 GB SATA Hard Drives RAID 1 on Intel ICH5R (v3.5.0.2568) MSI FX5600 - AGP 8X 128MB DDR Video Card (Nvidia v.52.16) Leadtek WinFast 2000 TV/FM PCI Multi-Media card U.S. Robotics 56K V90 PCI Modem Plextor PX-708A 8X DVD-RW (IDE 2 Master) Plextor PX-116A DVD-ROM (IDE 2 Slave) Teac 1.44 3.5" Floppy Disk Drive Creative Labs Audigy II Platinum Sound card Enermatic "Noistaker" 470 watt ATX Power Supply Win XP Pro SP-1 O.E.M. "Squeeky" wrote in message ... I have recently upgraded my system. Pertinent components a Gigabyte GA-8KNXP ver. 2.0 w/FH BIOS Intel P4 2.8C CPU w/Thermalright SP-94 heatsink and 90mm Panaflo fan 1GB (2x512) Super Talent PC4000 (DDR500) memory nVidia GeForce2 GTS graphics card (obviously not upgraded yet) Adaptec 29160 U160 SCSI adapter (for hard drives) BIOS Settings: CPU Host Frequency - 240.5MHz (962.2 FSB; 3.3677 GHz) Memory Freq. Formula - 2.0 (which means the memory and the CPU are synchronous ... 1:1) RAM - SPD settings (3-4-4-8) Delayed Transaction - Enabled PSB Parking - Enabled Command Per Clock - Auto [disabled] Fast Chip Select - Enabled Dynamic Paging Mode - Auto [disabled] Top Performance - Not enabled RAM Voltage Control - +0.1v [net 2.6v, the specified value for the RAM modules] AGP Voltage Control - +0.3v CPU Voltage Control - 1.5875v Power Supply: +3.3 rail yields 3.44 +5.0 rail yields 4.96 +12.0 rail yields 12.22 According to MBM, the power values stay constant (there is some variation, but not much). The system is stable (actually rock stable). The SP-94 heatsink is awesome (45C max with Prime 95 ... starting at a base temp of 32C); the CPU has definitely not reached it's overclock limit yet. The issue I have is with RAM. When I put the system together (I put the new MB into an existing system ... of course changing the chipset drivers, etc), it was unstable. Windows XP Pro would randomly crash (spontaneous reboot, not BSOD). After *much* experimentation (and sending one of the RAM modules back to the mfr. to be tested; it was fine), I determined that I could get stability by increasing the AGP voltage ... and the higher I set the AGP voltage, the more I could overclock. The RAM voltage is at stock (and anything higher causes memory errors on MemTest86 and MS WINDIAG); nothing spectacular about the CPU voltage (which so far has had no effect on overclocking, since I haven't pushed the CPU to its limit). Granted, 962.2 FSB with 1:1 isn't bad, but I think it can do better (or at least the CPU can). The memory should be able to reach a minimum of 1000FSB ... at least that is the spec. My surprise here is that *AGP* voltage has been the key to overclocking. Anyone know why? I know that the AGP card is tied to memory by virtue of AGP Aperture. I haven't played with any of the overclock settings for the video card (via the nVidia drivers). My next upgrade item is a video card (MSI FX 5900XT) ... don't know whether that will affect my ability to overclock. Unfortunately, I can't turn the AGP voltage up any higher (it is at the max ... +.3), so unless I can solve the AGP issue, I'm at the end of the line. Comments? Thanks |
#5
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So far as I know, the temps I reported are accurate. I use
Motherboard Monitor, and have the temps configured for the 8KNXP MB. When I first put the system together, I used the stock Intel HSF. Temps ranges from 32C to 57C ... more or less consistent with your results. The SP-94 does not interfere with the DSP2 (or its fan), though I have since removed that component as I couldn't establish any benefit for it. The heatsink does not touch the NB (or its fan). The SP-94 does not come with a fan ... you have to buy one separately. I have the Panaflo high speed fan, and I believe it is quiet ... of course, the medium speed would be quieter. You have to remove the MB to install the SP-94 (because it requires a brace on the backside of the MB). You can download installation instructions from the Thermalright website (before you buy). I was amazed by the performance of this heatsink! Having said all of that, I don't believe that your reported problems will be helped by the SP-94; they don't sound like HSF issues. And if you are not overclocking, you don't need a new $55 toy. If I had to guess, I would say the "Delayed Transaction" issue is a result of your RAM ... faster RAM, and the issue may go away. But it sounds like you are more interested in stability than speed, so the present solution is fine. FYI, I, too, have a Plextor 708A ... no noise. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * On Fri, 18 Jun 2004 18:04:33 GMT, "Kilgore Trout Jr" wrote: I'd like to know a little more about the Thermalright SP-94 heatsink and 90mm Panaflo fan. If accurate, your temperature readings are very impressive. My CPU temps typically run from 38-58 degrees C. Were you able to install the heatsink without removing the DSP2 daughter board or the DSP2 fan? What about the northbridge fan? Any mounting problems there? Also, how quiet is this setup? My stock Intel fan seems to make a lot of racket! I've never been interested in over clocking and have stuck with most of the default BIOS settings in order to maximize stability and reliability. Even so, I've found this board to be a little flakey. When I first set it up I experienced persistent cold boot problems. Sometimes it would start up and run great. Then it would freeze up on start up and I'd have to re-boot once or twice to get it going. Occasionally, when it did start up, it would act very sluggish and task manager would show near maximum CPU usage with no applications running! Installed a high performance power supply but saw no improvement. I finally discovered that by turning off "Delayed Transaction" in the BIOS, all these problems went away. "D.T. Enabled" is one of the "Fail Safe Default" settings so I over looked this possibility for a long time. Lately I've noticed a new intermittent problem. Sometimes when I boot up or bring the machine out of hibernation, I hear a fast clicking noise that sounds like an impending bearing failure in one of the case fans. The noise, however, comes from one or the other of the Plextor DVD drives. When this happens, the drive becomes unresponsive and the PC runs at a snails pace. Re-booting does not solve the problem! I have to turn it off completely and restart to get things up and running again. If anyone has any thoughts on this problem I'd like to hear from you! |
#6
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Don,
What do you think of the 9800 Pro (and its drivers)? I hadn't considered it because I got jaded on ATI's then-poor drivers about 10 years ago. But I can actually buy a 9800 Pro (128MB 256-bit) for $176 (OEM) ... less than the nVidia 5900XT (and the 9800 Pro apparently has materially better performance). * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 07:41:49 -0400, "M-Tech" wrote: I think you have more to gain with a more aggressive memory setting than eeking out that last 100mhz of cpu speed. I'm at 240 also but my mem settings are 2.5 3, 3, 6. I don't know why the increase in voltage to the agp slot makes your system stable. I'm at stock voltage except for cpu (same as yours)and I'm rock solid as well. Maybe it's the GTS card somehow? I'm running a 9800pro. Thanks for the report on the HSF, the stock cooler on my 2.8 had done a great job, but it's time for an SP94 I see...my temps are MUCH higher than yours:-) Don "Squeeky" wrote in message .. . I have recently upgraded my system. Pertinent components a |
#7
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Thanks Squeeky. Yah, I don't think my CPU temperatures are excessive or have
anything to do with the few problems I've had with this board. I am interested in trying to make it a little more quiet and have been looking at various heatsink/fan options. I hadn't heard of the SP-94 and appreciate your comments. I think I will also follow your lead and try removing the DSP2 unit. Nobody seems to be convinced that it serves any useful purpose and it is one more source of heat, fan noise and potential problems. Don't know what to think about the DT problem. Paid extra for a matched pair of Kingston 500 MB PC3500 RAM to insure stable operation, then had to dumb down the BIOS settings to get them to run reliably. Memtest86 runs for hours with no errors and I don't have any real performance issues so I guess I don't have too much to complain about. :^) "Squeeky" wrote in message ... So far as I know, the temps I reported are accurate. I use Motherboard Monitor, and have the temps configured for the 8KNXP MB. When I first put the system together, I used the stock Intel HSF. Temps ranges from 32C to 57C ... more or less consistent with your results. The SP-94 does not interfere with the DSP2 (or its fan), though I have since removed that component as I couldn't establish any benefit for it. The heatsink does not touch the NB (or its fan). The SP-94 does not come with a fan ... you have to buy one separately. I have the Panaflo high speed fan, and I believe it is quiet ... of course, the medium speed would be quieter. You have to remove the MB to install the SP-94 (because it requires a brace on the backside of the MB). You can download installation instructions from the Thermalright website (before you buy). I was amazed by the performance of this heatsink! Having said all of that, I don't believe that your reported problems will be helped by the SP-94; they don't sound like HSF issues. And if you are not overclocking, you don't need a new $55 toy. If I had to guess, I would say the "Delayed Transaction" issue is a result of your RAM ... faster RAM, and the issue may go away. But it sounds like you are more interested in stability than speed, so the present solution is fine. FYI, I, too, have a Plextor 708A ... no noise. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * On Fri, 18 Jun 2004 18:04:33 GMT, "Kilgore Trout Jr" wrote: I'd like to know a little more about the Thermalright SP-94 heatsink and 90mm Panaflo fan. If accurate, your temperature readings are very impressive. My CPU temps typically run from 38-58 degrees C. Were you able to install the heatsink without removing the DSP2 daughter board or the DSP2 fan? What about the northbridge fan? Any mounting problems there? Also, how quiet is this setup? My stock Intel fan seems to make a lot of racket! I've never been interested in over clocking and have stuck with most of the default BIOS settings in order to maximize stability and reliability. Even so, I've found this board to be a little flakey. When I first set it up I experienced persistent cold boot problems. Sometimes it would start up and run great. Then it would freeze up on start up and I'd have to re-boot once or twice to get it going. Occasionally, when it did start up, it would act very sluggish and task manager would show near maximum CPU usage with no applications running! Installed a high performance power supply but saw no improvement. I finally discovered that by turning off "Delayed Transaction" in the BIOS, all these problems went away. "D.T. Enabled" is one of the "Fail Safe Default" settings so I over looked this possibility for a long time. Lately I've noticed a new intermittent problem. Sometimes when I boot up or bring the machine out of hibernation, I hear a fast clicking noise that sounds like an impending bearing failure in one of the case fans. The noise, however, comes from one or the other of the Plextor DVD drives. When this happens, the drive becomes unresponsive and the PC runs at a snails pace. Re-booting does not solve the problem! I have to turn it off completely and restart to get things up and running again. If anyone has any thoughts on this problem I'd like to hear from you! |
#8
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I have not had a single issue with the 9800pro or the drivers.
She's been rock solid:-) Don "Squeeky" wrote in message ... Don, What do you think of the 9800 Pro (and its drivers)? I hadn't considered it because I got jaded on ATI's then-poor drivers about 10 years ago. But I can actually buy a 9800 Pro (128MB 256-bit) for $176 (OEM) ... less than the nVidia 5900XT (and the 9800 Pro apparently has materially better performance). * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 07:41:49 -0400, "M-Tech" wrote: I think you have more to gain with a more aggressive memory setting than eeking out that last 100mhz of cpu speed. I'm at 240 also but my mem settings are 2.5 3, 3, 6. I don't know why the increase in voltage to the agp slot makes your system stable. I'm at stock voltage except for cpu (same as yours)and I'm rock solid as well. Maybe it's the GTS card somehow? I'm running a 9800pro. Thanks for the report on the HSF, the stock cooler on my 2.8 had done a great job, but it's time for an SP94 I see...my temps are MUCH higher than yours:-) Don "Squeeky" wrote in message .. . I have recently upgraded my system. Pertinent components a |
#9
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I have a AIW9800 Pro on a 8KNXP and have had no problems with the card or
the drivers. I also swapped the stock HSF for a SP-94 and cannot get my temp above 49 Celsius when playing Unreal 2004. "M-Tech" wrote in message news I have not had a single issue with the 9800pro or the drivers. She's been rock solid:-) Don "Squeeky" wrote in message ... Don, What do you think of the 9800 Pro (and its drivers)? I hadn't considered it because I got jaded on ATI's then-poor drivers about 10 years ago. But I can actually buy a 9800 Pro (128MB 256-bit) for $176 (OEM) ... less than the nVidia 5900XT (and the 9800 Pro apparently has materially better performance). * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * On Thu, 17 Jun 2004 07:41:49 -0400, "M-Tech" wrote: I think you have more to gain with a more aggressive memory setting than eeking out that last 100mhz of cpu speed. I'm at 240 also but my mem settings are 2.5 3, 3, 6. I don't know why the increase in voltage to the agp slot makes your system stable. I'm at stock voltage except for cpu (same as yours)and I'm rock solid as well. Maybe it's the GTS card somehow? I'm running a 9800pro. Thanks for the report on the HSF, the stock cooler on my 2.8 had done a great job, but it's time for an SP94 I see...my temps are MUCH higher than yours:-) Don "Squeeky" wrote in message .. . I have recently upgraded my system. Pertinent components a |
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