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#1
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Bad mobo?
This morning when I went to use my computer it was dead. I had used it last
evening and it was fine - left it on and went to bed. The machine has been working fine for about a month and I haven't made any hardware changes since I initially assembled the system. I shut off the power to the computer and powered it back up. There were no beeps, all the fans started briefly and then stopped. The power supply is a 400 watt generic unit. I tried another 250 watt Codegen ATX P4 power supply just to power up the mobo. This power supply had been in service for years on a socket 370 board and should be adequate to power up just the mobo. The same thing. No beeps and the fans spin briefly and then stop. The only things I did notice was that there seemed to be a large draw on the electric circuit as I powered up with either power supply ( a light connected to the same power strip dimmed as the power switch on the power supply was switched on ). Also there is a LED lit on the mobo which has something to do with the AGP card voltage. Supposedly, the mobo can only use 1.5 volt AGP cards. If you try to use a 3 volt card, the LED will light up and the board won't work. I've tried two different AGP cards on the mobo. One was a 4x ASUS and the other is a MadDog 8x. Both are 1.5 volt cards, at least, the slot configuration is consistent with 1.5 volt cards. This is a SOYO i865 mobo with a Celeron D cpu with a ThermalTake fan, 2x256 Kingston 2700 sticks, a multimedia card and a couple case fans. Does any one have any suggestions? Wayne |
#2
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This is a SOYO i865 mobo with a Celeron D cpu with a ThermalTake fan,
2x256 Kingston 2700 sticks, a multimedia card and a couple case fans. Does any one have any suggestions? Have the capacitors blown? http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=195 I have dealt with quite a few motherboards that have stopped suddenly, nearly always it has been due to the blown capacitors. It is possible to change them, but it can be tricky getting hold of the proper capacitors. Also it can cost nearly the same as a new motherboard, depending on how many you need to replace. Adam S |
#3
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Adam S wrote:
This is a SOYO i865 mobo with a Celeron D cpu with a ThermalTake fan, 2x256 Kingston 2700 sticks, a multimedia card and a couple case fans. Does any one have any suggestions? Have the capacitors blown? http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=195 Thanks for this link. I am surprised by how common this problem has become lately. |
#4
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"ToolPackinMama" wrote in message ... Adam S wrote: This is a SOYO i865 mobo with a Celeron D cpu with a ThermalTake fan, 2x256 Kingston 2700 sticks, a multimedia card and a couple case fans. Does any one have any suggestions? Have the capacitors blown? http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=195 Thanks for this link. I am surprised by how common this problem has become lately. I seem to recall a news report some months ago about a sudden surge of poor quality capacitors being installed on motherboards. Hope they have this under control by now. Just did a Google search. I was right. Here is a copy of a report found on the internet: "Taiwanese component problems may cause mass recalls Faulty capacitors may afflict mobos, modems By Paul Hales: Tuesday 05 November 2002, 15:00 PROBLEMS DOGGING low-ESR aluminum capacitors produced in Taiwan could prompt recalls of desktop PCs in North American and beyond, research suggests. Taiwanese sources confirmed that as many as eleven manufacturers of low-ESR aluminum capacitors in Taiwan might have been using a poor-quality electrolyte in the capacitors. Reports first started to surface in September among "brand-name" computer manufacturers that there were problems with low-ESR aluminum capacitors produced in Taiwan. These reports suggest a poor-quality, water-based electrolyte had been supplied to multiple manufacturers of low-ESR aluminum electrolytic capacitors in Taiwan. The electrolyte, is a Taiwanese version of the Japanese P-50 water-based type, but produced without the proper additives required to stave off excess hydrogen gassing, according to Dennis Zogbi, owner of the Paumanok Group . "Consequently," writes Zogbi, "aluminum capacitors produced with the P-50 knock-off tend to fail catastrophically, by blowing open the rubber seal and leaking liquid electrolyte on the printed circuit board. These failures reportedly occur at half the rated lifetime of the components." It is not currently known how many market segments may have been affected by these poor parts, which can be found in motherboards, switchmode power supplies, modems and other PC boards. The failures of the aluminum capacitors might just be the 'tip of the iceberg,' says Zogbi. "Other component failures from low-cost Asian suppliers might be forthcoming," he warns. Around 30 per cent of the world's supply of aluminum capacitors is manufactured in Taiwan, according to the Paumanok Group. Confusion over which manufacturers may have used the faulty electrolyte is sending buyers back to Japan to source their capacitors. The extent of the problem in product that has already shipped won't become clear until components start failing, which may not happen until halfway through the products' lfe expectancy." END OF QUOTE |
#5
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wayneP wrote: This morning when I went to use my computer it was dead. The machine has been working fine for about a month There were no beeps, all the fans started briefly and then stopped. The power supply is a 400 watt generic unit. I tried another 250 watt Codegen ATX P4 power supply just to power up the mobo. This power supply had been in service for years on a socket 370 board and should be adequate to power up just the mobo. The same thing. This is a SOYO i865 mobo with a Celeron D cpu with a ThermalTake fan, 2x256 Kingston 2700 sticks, a multimedia card I had a really bad 250W PSU that would shut down in thirty seconds with just a 1.3 GHz Duron, slow graphics card, and no drives connected. OTOH another person had a high quality Fortron/Sparkle 250W PSU that was able to run his faster CPU, fairly fast graphics card, a couple of 7200 RPM HDs, and at least one CD-RW. My guess that your Codegen is lot more like my 250 generic than his 250W Fortron. I don't know if your system has developed bad capacitors on the mobo or inside the 400W PSU, but I have a 300W Antec only 1-2 years old where a couple of capacitors swelled up, one just a week after the other (capacitor ESR measured fine previously), although it still worked OK with the light load it was running (500 MHz CPU, 1 CD-RW, 1 HD, about 60W). |
#6
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Thanx for the suggestions.
I've replaced the battery and that didn't help. I've taken the mobo out and there isn't any obvious capacitor leaks or bulging and I haven't seen any evidence of shorting, although this failed during the night and there may have been some evidence of shorting but after 10-12 hours the smoke/smell would have dissipated. I did try to use the old 370 board and processor but that wouldn't work with the generic 400 watt power supply either. However, it won't work with the original 250 watt power supply either after powering up with the 400 watt PSU. I tried this 250 watt supply on the P4 Soyo board and it powered up the fans initially, but when I hooked everything back up I was back to the original position. No beeps, no fans and the LED on the mobo was lit. If there is something shorted on the mobo could that have blown the 250 watt Codegen PSU from the 370 system? Wayne "larry moe 'n curly" wrote in message ups.com... wayneP wrote: This morning when I went to use my computer it was dead. The machine has been working fine for about a month There were no beeps, all the fans started briefly and then stopped. The power supply is a 400 watt generic unit. I tried another 250 watt Codegen ATX P4 power supply just to power up the mobo. This power supply had been in service for years on a socket 370 board and should be adequate to power up just the mobo. The same thing. This is a SOYO i865 mobo with a Celeron D cpu with a ThermalTake fan, 2x256 Kingston 2700 sticks, a multimedia card I had a really bad 250W PSU that would shut down in thirty seconds with just a 1.3 GHz Duron, slow graphics card, and no drives connected. OTOH another person had a high quality Fortron/Sparkle 250W PSU that was able to run his faster CPU, fairly fast graphics card, a couple of 7200 RPM HDs, and at least one CD-RW. My guess that your Codegen is lot more like my 250 generic than his 250W Fortron. I don't know if your system has developed bad capacitors on the mobo or inside the 400W PSU, but I have a 300W Antec only 1-2 years old where a couple of capacitors swelled up, one just a week after the other (capacitor ESR measured fine previously), although it still worked OK with the light load it was running (500 MHz CPU, 1 CD-RW, 1 HD, about 60W). |
#7
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wayneC wrote: I've replaced the battery and that didn't help. I've taken the mobo out and there isn't any obvious capacitor leaks or bulging and I haven't seen any evidence of shorting, although this failed during the night and there may have been some evidence of shorting but after 10-12 hours the smoke/smell would have dissipated. I did try to use the old 370 board and processor but that wouldn't work with the generic 400 watt power supply either. However, it won't work with the original 250 watt power supply either after powering up with the 400 watt PSU. I tried this 250 watt supply on the P4 Soyo board and it powered up the fans initially, but when I hooked everything back up I was back to the original position. No beeps, no fans and the LED on the mobo was lit. If there is something shorted on the mobo could that have blown the 250 watt Codegen PSU from the 370 system? Any good PSU won't be damaged by a short, but my own not-so-good 250W (not Codegen), despite containing protection circuitry meant to prevent such damage, blew an MOSFET anyway when its +3.3V rail was shorted by a DIMM plugged in backwards. I've also had some PSUs blow their high voltage transistors when they were shorted and their fuses blew, including an old Enermax. Are you saying that when you inspected the mobo, you didn't see any places where copper traces ran close enough to the holes that a screw or brass standoff _could_ have touched them? Or that the mobo could have touched the mobo tray if flexed? If a chip wasn't damaged, then it's likely that the mobo can be salvaged by changing a few bad capacitors, MOSFETs, or diodes. The latter two can be tested with just a multimeter, but bad capacitors often seem OK when checked with a multimeter. |
#8
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larry moe 'n curly,
I didn't see anything out of the ordinary when I inspected the board. The fact of the matter is that the machine had been running flawlessly except for an LED on the board that seemed to indicate that the AGP card was running at the wrong voltage (3.3 instead of 1.5). However, I tried two different AGP cards, one a 4x card and the other an 8x card and the LED remained on; so I just ignored it. After adding the 8x board there was what sounded like an alarm at boot as the AGP info appeared on the monitor. There was nothing anywhere about this alarm and I it wasn't there using the 4x card. A note to SOYO tech support was never answered. The machine was operating fine and was left on most of the time for the month or so since assembly. After finishing some work one evening and leaving the machine on, when I went to use it the next morning it was dead except the LED on the mobo was still lit. Wayne "larry moe 'n curly" wrote in message ups.com... wayneC wrote: I've replaced the battery and that didn't help. I've taken the mobo out and there isn't any obvious capacitor leaks or bulging and I haven't seen any evidence of shorting, although this failed during the night and there may have been some evidence of shorting but after 10-12 hours the smoke/smell would have dissipated. I did try to use the old 370 board and processor but that wouldn't work with the generic 400 watt power supply either. However, it won't work with the original 250 watt power supply either after powering up with the 400 watt PSU. I tried this 250 watt supply on the P4 Soyo board and it powered up the fans initially, but when I hooked everything back up I was back to the original position. No beeps, no fans and the LED on the mobo was lit. If there is something shorted on the mobo could that have blown the 250 watt Codegen PSU from the 370 system? Any good PSU won't be damaged by a short, but my own not-so-good 250W (not Codegen), despite containing protection circuitry meant to prevent such damage, blew an MOSFET anyway when its +3.3V rail was shorted by a DIMM plugged in backwards. I've also had some PSUs blow their high voltage transistors when they were shorted and their fuses blew, including an old Enermax. Are you saying that when you inspected the mobo, you didn't see any places where copper traces ran close enough to the holes that a screw or brass standoff _could_ have touched them? Or that the mobo could have touched the mobo tray if flexed? If a chip wasn't damaged, then it's likely that the mobo can be salvaged by changing a few bad capacitors, MOSFETs, or diodes. The latter two can be tested with just a multimeter, but bad capacitors often seem OK when checked with a multimeter. |
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