Q: Why don't desktops us mobile cpus?

On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 11:08:56 -0800, JAD thoughtfully wrote:


"ISOHaven" wrote in message
...
Oh, well...thanks for your approval. But you can stick it where the sun
don't shine. That was for your benifit and it wont happen again.

Notice you are the only one here bitching about my actions? Well you
and that other guy that has given ZERO input other then sticking up for
you.


Don't know him. he must be one of your co workers or someone found in the
NG you hang in. Obviuosly sick of the constant forcing of your opinion on
everyone
I'm the only one cause I am doing such a good job they don't feel the need
to chime in...........................ROFLMAO



Exactly


If you wouldn't spend so much time posting on company time, maybe you
could find a laptop that will do the job for the people in which
you....work for?



[snip]

On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 12:49:11 -0800, ISOHaven thoughtfully wrote:

"Soooooo you buy substandard equipment for your company or what?" Laptops
are substandard to desktops PERIOD!

"Another opnion of what parts are in a laptop?" No just the facts. I also
like how you have completely ignored all the relevant info and you
continue to spout nothing but BS.

So give us facts of your own. I just want ONE SPEC. I want to know all
about your HDD in your laptop! Why do you keep avoiding this?

All components in a laptop are substandard when compared to a desktop.
Even you can NOT deny that. That's why a laptop IN THE SAME CLASS can
NEVER outperform a desktop.





Dell XPS M710 Gaming laptop.

[snip]

On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 06:14:21 +0000, kony thoughtfully wrote:

[snip]

The market will buy anything the manufacturers sell if they think they
need it, before there were mobiles everyone had desktops now many have
laptops. Desktops are modular not so much laptops but for general
computing laptop cpus can do the same job as desktop cpus.

No, they can't. They can do the same job as slightly older desktops
maybe, but then someone would just keep using their older desktop if
performance didn't matter, the last thing they'd do is buy a new system
at a cost premium.


Really??

Dell XPS M710

PCs have reached the platue where it costs more to build a system from
scratch than to buy a complete product. Most people purchase PC/laptops
by buying the best PC within their budget. They may spend a bit more for
a faster cpu or more memory or bigger hd but they have a price in mind and
they'll pick PCs to match limit whether Celeron or P4.

Ok...good. Let's go with that. As I said, "same level".

Gaming:
Asus A8N32-SLI
Dual 7800GTX 512MB in SLI mode
AMD 4400+
2GB of Corsair 3500LL matched memory

That will stomp your laptop regardless of the drives I use. If you have
numbers that prove me wrong then let's see them! I would love to see them
and I wold LOVE to see the laptop that would kick my ass.

BUT, what does a gaming laptop have to do with SAVING electricity and this
thread? That's been my whole point all along. Nothing this guy brings up
is EVER within scope of the convo.

On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 05:55:44 +0000, kony thoughtfully wrote:
[snip]

They certainly do. People just accept it. Unquestionably I can hear when
the fans kick on, on my laptop. It then becomes louder than any fans on
the desktop system I'm currently typing on, though it's mostly due to the
higher RPM and small fan. Even so, the laptop heat issue is another kind,
that of only making the reductions to the extent of it being necessary for
the thing to work at all in a small battery powered form factor. They
don't really care what the CPU uses from a 'green' aspect.


Not that there aren't problems but you're the first to complain about
laptop fan noise. My laps never had heat or noise issues. Yours
homemade?




My money and computing is irreverent as to why AMD and Intel continue to
produce "desktop" cpus.

Why does it bother you? You CAN choose a Via Eden if you want one.


It was a question, an innocent question so I thought. I wonder why the
big 3 didn't just make one line of processor that will work in laptops,
desktops, media PCs, servers and workstations.


I understand for use in workstations and servers
but not for Joe and Jane Average.

Ah, so you feel you should decide what someone else does? Ironically
enough I somewhat agree, that some people need babysitters to retrain
their behavior when it comes to pollution causing activities, but that
doesn't mean it's realistic to ponder over it, as if that would do any
good. Posting the topic here also does little good, perhaps you should
be petitioning the motherboard and CPU manufacturers to produce more of
the products you want.

I'm really happy with AMD, Intel and Via. Frankly, I've been
grateful to Intel and IBM for the work they've done, both great American
companies for me. Really, really grateful to Intel for past successes.
I've used processors from Cyrix before they went under but now I have 2
AMDs one replaced my PIII.


If Intel only produces "mobile" type
cpus everyone would buy "mobile" cpus and motherboards.

So you feel fit to force this on everyone? What about that "next" guy
that comes along and decides that someone you want, isn't good for other
people so you'll just have to do without (whatever)? It seems easy
enough to suggest until that kind of principle starts effecting your
desires rather than those of others.

You wouldn't care if Intel said the roadmap lead soley to a dual-core
processor capable of running all know apps and OS in both laptops or
desktops.

I don't feel they should devote resoures to a designated "mobile CPU,
but rather the more direct approach, to make them ordinary desktop CPUs,
simply lower power consuming ones. The catch- they won't be able to
just ramp up clock speed for the gains, it's going to cost more per each
CPU, and designs will probably not last as long either so there's more
development costs as well.

There is still a very real next-killer-app on the distant horizon for
PCs, virtual reality, and sooner than that, effective voice-command
control. Don't expect the industry to concede performance in favor of
power until these milestones are met, unless it just happens to coincide
with their agenda, like continuing to use passive cooling (so
ultimately, CPU TDP can't go up much more from what it is right now
unless something exotic like nanotubes or other revolutionary cooling
methods became cost-effective).

Actually, I think PCs as we know them will go bye-bye within 10-20yrs.
As much as I hate to think it, Media PCs will replace traditional PCs and
communicators and tablets will replace laptops. As soon as prices drop
you'll be looking for a MediaPC to play games, amusements and productivity
on 32-65in HDTVs in 5.1 audio.

"You haven't been in the newsgroups much otherwise you'd have read all the
posts about heating and noise. Laptops don't seem to have those issues."
Somehow I missed the heat comment. Laptops don't suffer from heat issues.
Where the heck have you been!?!?!?!? The average complaint of a decent
powered laptop is the heat they produce! Why do you think there are so many
laptop coolers out there? Keep a decent laptop on your LAP for any length
of time and if you don't sweat off 5 pounds I'd be surprised.

I'll agress that recently some of these laptops have gotten a LOT better
with that issue. The newest thinkpads we've purchased latley, the X41 and
the Z60t are MUCH better but they still heat up your lap pretty well.



"jaster" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:29:45 -0800, ISOHaven thoughtfully wrote:

I think a direct answer to your question is: The reason they don't make
very many mobile CPUs for desktops is because there is NO MARKET for it.
Take a look around, is anyone else asking this question? No.

Well someone has to be first.

Mobile CPUs are designed to be mobile. Not stationary. I just read
through this entire post and I still don't even know why you care? Why
are you doing this? What is your point? I heard some talk about
computer
companies needing to be more green. What the heck is that crap all
about?
Noise? I seriously doubt computer noise is affecting the environment.
Heat? I think the other equipment in your house generate more heat, not
sure what the point is here. Power, well, see below.


You haven't been in the newsgroups much otherwise you'd have read all the
posts about heating and noise. Laptops don't seem to have those issues.

Buying a mobile cpu versus a cheap P4 is not going to change your bank
account very much and it's NOT going to change your electric bill either.

If you are doing this just because "you want to" then your first answer
by
Paul was the end of this convo.

If all you need to do is "surf AOL/MSN, email, print pictures, balance
the
checkbook, maybe play music and video" then go buy yourself a $300
Linspire machine and REALLY save yourself some money.

Seems like you're splitting hairs here for no good reason.


My money and computing is irreverent as to why AMD and Intel continue to
produce "desktop" cpus. I understand for use in workstations and servers
but not for Joe and Jane Average. If Intel only produces "mobile" type
cpus everyone would buy "mobile" cpus and motherboards.

Youngsters don't remember that early PCs were developed and
manufactured only for office use and enthusiasts who could obtain PCs
until Flight Simulator, Sinclair and Apple opened the market. S

"ISOHaven" wrote in message
...
Ok...good. Let's go with that. As I said, "same level".

Gaming:
Asus A8N32-SLI
Dual 7800GTX 512MB in SLI mode
AMD 4400+
2GB of Corsair 3500LL matched memory

That will stomp your laptop regardless of the drives I use. If you have
numbers that prove me wrong then let's see them! I would love to see them
and I wold LOVE to see the laptop that would kick my ass.

BUT, what does a gaming laptop have to do with SAVING electricity and this
thread? That's been my whole point all along. Nothing this guy brings up
is EVER within scope of the convo.



heh I said of equal hardware configuration...and ANYONE who falls for
sli......is the biggest dumbass EVER. The technology was garbage in the 90's
and its even more ridiculous today. You have now shown your actual
colors...an AMD gameboy..that's all ya got going for ya... SLI LO -
FREAKIN LLLLLLLLLL

And what constitutes kicking your ass game boy? shooting your ass dead in a
game?...OH BROTHER. CONVERSATION over.

"and ANYONE who falls for sli......is the biggest dumbass EVER. The
technology was garbage in the 90's and its even more ridiculous today."
That's probably the single most rediculous comment you have made so far. I
suppose all the benchmark numbers are all bull**** right? "The man" has
faked them all and they mean nothing?

"SLI LO - FREAKIN LLLLLLLLLL"
Um.....ok.....

"And what constitutes kicking your ass game boy? shooting your ass dead in a
game?..."
Yeah, that's exactly what I was talking about....good for you....

OH BROTHER. CONVERSATION over.
Finaly!

"ISOHaven" wrote in message
...
and cheaper BTW...which is right up your alley...you know
I like how you harp on something for so long that you start to believe it
as fact. That's hilarious!!!

...next to the box you'll be living in....when 'your' company catches on.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight!


so basically You don't know then?
I have to figure out 99% of the crap you spew, cause it makes little
sense.
Wow, I spell out all the specs for you and you have this much trouble
figuring it out? Yup, you are about stupid as our graphics artists here.
Why are graphics guys so ****ing dumb when it comes to normal ****????


So to end this....Are you saying that 'dollar for dollar' laptops can't
compete with desktops, or are you saying that NO WAY can a laptop out
perform a desktop of equal hardware (as equal as you can get AFA CPU)?
HOLY CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!! You actualy sound like you are ready for a real
conversation..... it must be a trap.... not sure if I should continue....
Hum...I would bite but I feel I have explained my thoughts well enough. I
no longer need to explain anything to you. I might sound like a broken
record here but again YOU are the only one confused by my words. I've
used a LOT of the same words in the rest of this thread and was able to
get normal responses from everyone else.


So when it boils down...you cop out......

JAD wrote:
"David Maynard" wrote in message
...

jaster wrote:


On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 20:04:42 +0000, kony thoughtfully wrote:



On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 18:26:01 GMT, jaster wrote:



On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 08:00:20 +0000, kony thoughtfully wrote:



On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 02:45:18 GMT, jaster wrote:



I know the motherboards are different but is there a reason why
desktop
computer aren't built to use mobile cpus?

Because mobile CPUs are usually optimized for low power consumption,
not performance. It matters far more when one needs it to run off a
battery.

Exactly why cpu and motherboard manufacturers should consider mobile
cpus.

Actually that is exactly why they wouldn't, because they're (desktops)
not
running off battery power the vast majority of the time.



I think you're stuck in a "it's a desktop stupid" line of thought.
Maybe
I should have asked why are there desktop cpus now that there are mobile
cpus. I think there is a huge market for desktops. Some people are
making laptops their next PC, some even buy docking stations and monitors
for their laptops. So if Intel/AMD stopped making "desktop" cpus and
only
manufactured "mobile" cpus what would be the loss?

Performance and cost.




Hmmm....are you talking the same spec machine, desktop Vs laptop,

There's no such thing as a 'same spec' desktop vs laptop or else there
would not be two different names for them.

and there
will be a performance hit?

And/or cost.

5 years ago I would have been in the same line of thinking, but today, I'm
inclined to say that there is little if any. Some of these tricked out
gaming LTs are unbelievably fast.

For the same price as a desktop of the same performance? And are you 100%
sure it doesn't throttle under sustained full load? Just to name a couple.

But the question I responded to was "desktop" vs "mobile" CPUs and the
simple fact of the matter is they are designed for different environments
and the attendant requirements. A mobile may have different packaging for
space considerations, more aggressive power conservation measures for
battery consumption, different thermal characteristics, lower voltage
operation etc. They just ain't the same thing if you are, in fact,
optimizing for the 'mobile' environment.