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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
Got this like $40US Baofeng UV-5RA-plus, 2-Band HAM (one band is like
down around 140 for freq, other starts around 400), months ago and now just it getting up and working. More like programming it via USB serial-reported COM3/4 cable/chipped-device with CHIRP open-source radio software. Got it to work (updated VB routines and lots of finagling/hacking on an older XP/SP1). Total newb, so I've tons of radio terms, features on this radio for a reason to learn them. Dumb 1st question. In a big metropolitan area, tons of people, sophisticated trunking systems and government voice encoding and stuff. Though, all I want to use it for is a scanner. Get some "repeaters" in and working, hear some noise other than prerecorded computer generated Nation Weather Services programming. So far I'm not having much luck...it's like an episode from "The Walking Dead." That normal? When's all the traffic supposed to be happening? Beginning to wonder whether a CB would have served better. |
#2
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
Flasherly wrote:
Got this like $40US Baofeng UV-5RA-plus, 2-Band HAM (one band is like down around 140 for freq, other starts around 400), months ago and now just it getting up and working. More like programming it via USB serial-reported COM3/4 cable/chipped-device with CHIRP open-source radio software. Got it to work (updated VB routines and lots of finagling/hacking on an older XP/SP1). Total newb, so I've tons of radio terms, features on this radio for a reason to learn them. Dumb 1st question. In a big metropolitan area, tons of people, sophisticated trunking systems and government voice encoding and stuff. Though, all I want to use it for is a scanner. Get some "repeaters" in and working, hear some noise other than prerecorded computer generated Nation Weather Services programming. So far I'm not having much luck...it's like an episode from "The Walking Dead." That normal? When's all the traffic supposed to be happening? Beginning to wonder whether a CB would have served better. Look up the band plan for your area, then see if the scanner is scanning the right area. Amateurs can only obtain licenses for limited bands. http://barrowhamradio.org/images/art...r_BandPlan.pdf You can also wait for night-fall, and see if skip brings in more stations for you. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_propagation The antenna on a hand-held will likely be more effective at the higher frequencies. Just a guess. Paul |
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
On Sat, 19 Apr 2014 18:51:04 -0400, Paul wrote:
Look up the band plan for your area, then see if the scanner is scanning the right area. Amateurs can only obtain licenses for limited bands. http://barrowhamradio.org/images/art...r_BandPlan.pdf You can also wait for night-fall, and see if skip brings in more stations for you. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_propagation The antenna on a hand-held will likely be more effective at the higher frequencies. Just a guess. I read that too on the antenna, looked around and went ahead with an extra, better one. Do whatever you want with it, legally w/out a license, until not just listening or illegally pushing the TRX button. General forum talk is 35-60 miles reception range with this unit - depending, to include severely limited, on conditions. Find what local frequencies I can, I guess, and start studying how to correctly enter/store their parameters. Then try the scan part. Not sure about that higher freq, second band. I know I've got something either on power lines behind me or interference nearby -- got a shortwave that's effectively useless because of it, although I don't hear its "signature churn" on this HAM thing so far. The local government weather station comes in nice, just kind of strange see how limited repeaters or general frequencies listed available locally (it'll hold 128 channels), then plugging them in and not hearing anything. So far. |
#4
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
Flasherly wrote:
On Sat, 19 Apr 2014 18:51:04 -0400, Paul wrote: Look up the band plan for your area, then see if the scanner is scanning the right area. Amateurs can only obtain licenses for limited bands. http://barrowhamradio.org/images/art...r_BandPlan.pdf You can also wait for night-fall, and see if skip brings in more stations for you. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_propagation The antenna on a hand-held will likely be more effective at the higher frequencies. Just a guess. I read that too on the antenna, looked around and went ahead with an extra, better one. Do whatever you want with it, legally w/out a license, until not just listening or illegally pushing the TRX button. General forum talk is 35-60 miles reception range with this unit - depending, to include severely limited, on conditions. Find what local frequencies I can, I guess, and start studying how to correctly enter/store their parameters. Then try the scan part. Not sure about that higher freq, second band. I know I've got something either on power lines behind me or interference nearby -- got a shortwave that's effectively useless because of it, although I don't hear its "signature churn" on this HAM thing so far. The local government weather station comes in nice, just kind of strange see how limited repeaters or general frequencies listed available locally (it'll hold 128 channels), then plugging them in and not hearing anything. So far. Doesn't the unit have a channel scan mode ? Connecting an oddball antenna is OK, as long as you don't key the mike. You want the antenna impedance to match the impedance of the radio, before pumping power into the antenna. For receive, a mismatch would be an efficiency issue, but wouldn't damage anything. For example, if I had your radio right now, I could hook it up to the TV antenna I built (good for UHF and VHF combined). It uses a balun, and has close to 75 ohms impedance looking into the balun (actual impedance varies with frequency). Which would be a rough match for a 75 ohm radio. Some antenna configurations are 300 ohms, and air line or ladder line can be as high as 450 ohms differential. And you don't have to build an antenna, to figure out the impedance. Software like 4NEC2 can be used to simulate antenna performance, and tell you all sorts of things about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numeric...magnetics_Code http://www.qsl.net/4nec2/ (used to verify my antenna) My antenna is five feet high, five feet wide, and more than 18 inches deep. And has a gain of 15dBi. And the beamwidth is kinda narrow, so you have to point it at the signal source on the horizon. The actual antenna performance, did not match the simulation (there is gain at the top of the UHF band that should not be there). This is what hams use. The tower (elevation), is more than half the battle. Elevation helps a lot. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yagi_antenna Paul |
#5
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
On Sat, 19 Apr 2014, Paul wrote:
Flasherly wrote: On Sat, 19 Apr 2014 18:51:04 -0400, Paul wrote: Look up the band plan for your area, then see if the scanner is scanning the right area. Amateurs can only obtain licenses for limited bands. http://barrowhamradio.org/images/art...r_BandPlan.pdf You can also wait for night-fall, and see if skip brings in more stations for you. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_propagation The antenna on a hand-held will likely be more effective at the higher frequencies. Just a guess. I read that too on the antenna, looked around and went ahead with an extra, better one. Do whatever you want with it, legally w/out a license, until not just listening or illegally pushing the TRX button. General forum talk is 35-60 miles reception range with this unit - depending, to include severely limited, on conditions. Find what local frequencies I can, I guess, and start studying how to correctly enter/store their parameters. Then try the scan part. Not sure about that higher freq, second band. I know I've got something either on power lines behind me or interference nearby -- got a shortwave that's effectively useless because of it, although I don't hear its "signature churn" on this HAM thing so far. The local government weather station comes in nice, just kind of strange see how limited repeaters or general frequencies listed available locally (it'll hold 128 channels), then plugging them in and not hearing anything. So far. Doesn't the unit have a channel scan mode ? Who knows. I'm not sure if he's using "ham" in a generic sense, or if it's actually labelled as such. I've never heard of the company, so clearly it's one of those cheap Chinese imports that are now starting to come over. If it's more like a commerical handheld, which happens to cover the ham frequencies, it may require programming. Oddly, that is in part to ensure the commercial stuff isn't used in the wrong place, all kinds of knobs means someone might just start using a ham frequency "because it was empty". So you'd need a computer, and a cable, and the programming software. There is less and less one can receive. The "public service" stuff moving higher in frequency, or to trunked systems which mean you really don't get anything from just tuning the frequencies. And since most transmissions are short, no matter what the service, that doesn't leave much for listening. He seems to get the 162.XXX MHz weather stations, so the thing seems to work. I'd argue that the weather stations are some of the most consistent VHF transmissions, I was going to say other than broadcast, but the weather stations are broadcasting, albeit in the VHF marine band. A busy repeater may be on quite a bit, but one has to find one first. Michael |
#6
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
On 04/19/2014 09:11 PM, Michael Black wrote:
There is less and less one can receive. The "public service" stuff moving higher in frequency, or to trunked systems which mean you really don't get anything from just tuning the frequencies. Our local PD went with digital a few years back, and then last year encrypted everything, including the dispatch line. Apparently they will give out an encryption code to "major news organizations", but the rest of us are SOL. *******s. Jon |
#7
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 06:44:44 -0700, Jon Danniken
wrote: Our local PD went with digital a few years back, and then last year encrypted everything, including the dispatch line. Apparently they will give out an encryption code to "major news organizations", but the rest of us are SOL. *******s. I used work on one, a trunked system that went into effect probably 10, 15 years ago. They sent me over to the Dept. of The P.D. for the cop-shop dispatcher's trunked orientation put on by the Radio Shop or a industry rep, where I dutifully took notes and looked the part. Reminded me of airplaine transmissions I worked with in Electronic Warfare, although I mostly stayed out of the shop and did installation, tests and debriefed operators retuning from sorties. Give me a microphone, though, and watch out. I love talking to towers, waking people up in the middle of the night, for collating interesting information from interesting people into the "thick of it." Takes a special person to come out of deep sleep and move immediately into full-bore mode. Not saying I could do it, but I sure admire and like working with them. I was thinking of the repeater, too, what Michael said, that there should be some cross-city, transpositional relay chitchat traffic going on. It's a commercial-grade unit, all that stuff he also mentions, only not well regarded for commerce-grade by all in terms of usage [aside a unit costing 10-times more]. The $40US Baofeng UV-5RA+, I'm guesstimating I got a dedicated antenna and USB cable, I've heard of going in lots off Ebay on occasion for $25. Part of the reason for their ill-reception is the Chinese government actually subsidized their manufacture, in order to go up against capitalism and the commercial market of Japanese units likely to be typically placed for America's communications infrastructure. Just a softspot. I did the exact same thing with a shortwave unit from China that set me back $50US, when it's counterparts out of RatShack, say a Grundig, might run four times more the price. Arguably, although I wouldn't, the WWW is setting back a role of individuals and means of radio transmission at their disposal to communicate between others with a similar inkling. |
#8
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
At Sun, 20 Apr 2014 12:58:05 -0400, Flasherly rearranged some electrons to
write: On Sun, 20 Apr 2014 06:44:44 -0700, Jon Danniken wrote: Our local PD went with digital a few years back, and then last year encrypted everything, including the dispatch line. Apparently they will give out an encryption code to "major news organizations", but the rest of us are SOL. *******s. I used work on one, a trunked system that went into effect probably 10, 15 years ago. They sent me over to the Dept. of The P.D. for the cop-shop dispatcher's trunked orientation put on by the Radio Shop or a industry rep, where I dutifully took notes and looked the part. Reminded me of airplaine transmissions I worked with in Electronic Warfare, although I mostly stayed out of the shop and did installation, tests and debriefed operators retuning from sorties. Give me a microphone, though, and watch out. I love talking to towers, waking people up in the middle of the night, for collating interesting information from interesting people into the "thick of it." Takes a special person to come out of deep sleep and move immediately into full-bore mode. Not saying I could do it, but I sure admire and like working with them. I was thinking of the repeater, too, what Michael said, that there should be some cross-city, transpositional relay chitchat traffic going on. It's a commercial-grade unit, all that stuff he also mentions, only not well regarded for commerce-grade by all in terms of usage [aside a unit costing 10-times more]. The $40US Baofeng UV-5RA+, I'm guesstimating I got a dedicated antenna and USB cable, I've heard of going in lots off Ebay on occasion for $25. Part of the reason for their ill-reception is the Chinese government actually subsidized their manufacture, in order to go up against capitalism and the commercial market of Japanese units likely to be typically placed for America's communications infrastructure. Just a softspot. I did the exact same thing with a shortwave unit from China that set me back $50US, when it's counterparts out of RatShack, say a Grundig, might run four times more the price. Arguably, although I wouldn't, the WWW is setting back a role of individuals and means of radio transmission at their disposal to communicate between others with a similar inkling. The radio you have is a dual band (2 meters and 70 cm). The antenna that comes with it is not that good for general coverage (and not that good for 2m and 70 cm either). It's also not good for general purpose scanning, as it does not have a general coverage receiver. And, it only receives analog AM and FM... most public service agencies have gone to digital systems, so if you bought it just to scan public service frequencies, you're going to be disappointed. Please do not press the TX button if you are unlicensed. The FCC takes unlicensed transmissions seriously. It is actually quite easy to obtain an amateur radio license; in the US you take a 35 question exam to get the lowest level license. No Morse code test is required as it used to be. You can find amateur radio repeaters in your area by searching several web sites, here is one of many: http://www.repeaterbook.com/ Repeaters have an input frequency (the frequency it listens on) and an output frequency (the frequency YOU listen on). For the 2m band, they are typically separated by 0.6 MHz. If the repeater is listed as "145.150 -" it means that the repeater output frequency is 145.150, and the "-" indicates the input frequency is 0.6 MHz down (144.550). The radio programming software will indicate this split as "duplex" plus or minus. The difference between the two frequencies is called the "offset". For the 70cm band, the offset is typically 5 MHz, either + or -. Although, without a license, you will not be able to have any conversations, only listen. The Bao Feng software is not very friendly, and you have to use the right version depending on the firmware version of the radio you have. This website may help you: http://www.miklor.com/ Signed, A licensed amateur radio operator |
#9
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
On Mon, 21 Apr 2014 03:33:39 +0000 (UTC), David
wrote: Hey, Dave. The radio you have is a dual band (2 meters and 70 cm). The antenna that comes with it is not that good for general coverage (and not that good for 2m and 70 cm either). It's also not good for general purpose scanning, as it does not have a general coverage receiver. And, it only receives analog AM and FM... most public service agencies have gone to digital systems, so if you bought it just to scan public service frequencies, you're going to be disappointed. Nope, no expectations for Public Services or a general trend into aggregated trunked systems;- perhaps a few stray privately-owned, maintained utilities, and such. Please do not press the TX button if you are unlicensed. The FCC takes unlicensed transmissions seriously. Yes, that is the general consensus of HAM operators, despite and not a substantial regard from rampant Amazon reviewers;- Ignore them is the indicated course in response from a licensed being addressed by a rogue operator. It is actually quite easy to obtain an amateur radio license; in the US you take a 35 question exam to get the lowest level license. No Morse code test is required as it used to be. Most excellent. I'd heard it wasn't like yesteryear, that testing restrictions were relaxed. Thanks for the specifics for further qualification. You can find amateur radio repeaters in your area by searching several web sites, here is one of many: http://www.repeaterbook.com/ Repeaters have an input frequency (the frequency it listens on) and an output frequency (the frequency YOU listen on). For the 2m band, they are typically separated by 0.6 MHz. If the repeater is listed as "145.150 -" it means that the repeater output frequency is 145.150, and the "-" indicates the input frequency is 0.6 MHz down (144.550). The radio programming software will indicate this split as "duplex" plus or minus. The difference between the two frequencies is called the "offset". Excellent again. I'd already run into that, the offsets, just (hadn't really sunken in or) haven't quite gotten around to importing a locally pertinent CVS file of local activity into CHIRP, which I was pleasantly surprised to connect to and establish a serial/USB interface to the Baofeng's ROM routines. Well enough to use the software interface to "program in" a weather station, (past some MS VB updates, thankfully). For the 70cm band, the offset is typically 5 MHz, either + or -. Noted. As in as opposed to .6MHz offset delineator indicated on the prior bandwidth. Although, without a license, you will not be able to have any conversations, only listen. I'm all ears. The Bao Feng software is not very friendly, and you have to use the right version depending on the firmware version of the radio you have. This website may help you: http://www.miklor.com/ But of course. I'm well enough familiar with Chinglish to have at least found and immediately adopted CHIRP;- Mildor, I'll save, of course, along with your post in the odds&ends section, a directory where I'm collecting useful information. Signed, A licensed amateur radio operator Hey you. Appreciate your taking the time to point out a few discrepancies, the sites and offsets, notably. How about this replacement antenna, if you don't mind. (I'll look it up off that initial order.) Think it'll make much difference, or am short-stroking and better off looking to utilize a mast (as Paul mentioned) if I want to seriously consider any/much else reception-wise while inside my house? Anyway here it is...(please "pull," backspace the line below into one line for a valid link, keeping all characters intact. Sorry this Usenet reader craps when posting out more than an allotted characters per line to the server.) http://www.amazon.com /gp/product/B008P7YX4Y /ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 A big 10-4 & thanks again - -Flash |
#10
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HAM Radio [& The Horror of it All]
At Mon, 21 Apr 2014 11:08:45 -0400, Flasherly rearranged some electrons to
write: On Mon, 21 Apr 2014 03:33:39 +0000 (UTC), David wrote: Hey, Dave. The radio you have is a dual band (2 meters and 70 cm). The antenna that comes with it is not that good for general coverage (and not that good for 2m and 70 cm either). It's also not good for general purpose scanning, as it does not have a general coverage receiver. And, it only receives analog AM and FM... most public service agencies have gone to digital systems, so if you bought it just to scan public service frequencies, you're going to be disappointed. Nope, no expectations for Public Services or a general trend into aggregated trunked systems;- perhaps a few stray privately-owned, maintained utilities, and such. Please do not press the TX button if you are unlicensed. The FCC takes unlicensed transmissions seriously. Yes, that is the general consensus of HAM operators, despite and not a substantial regard from rampant Amazon reviewers;- Ignore them is the indicated course in response from a licensed being addressed by a rogue operator. It is actually quite easy to obtain an amateur radio license; in the US you take a 35 question exam to get the lowest level license. No Morse code test is required as it used to be. Most excellent. I'd heard it wasn't like yesteryear, that testing restrictions were relaxed. Thanks for the specifics for further qualification. You can find amateur radio repeaters in your area by searching several web sites, here is one of many: http://www.repeaterbook.com/ Repeaters have an input frequency (the frequency it listens on) and an output frequency (the frequency YOU listen on). For the 2m band, they are typically separated by 0.6 MHz. If the repeater is listed as "145.150 -" it means that the repeater output frequency is 145.150, and the "-" indicates the input frequency is 0.6 MHz down (144.550). The radio programming software will indicate this split as "duplex" plus or minus. The difference between the two frequencies is called the "offset". Excellent again. I'd already run into that, the offsets, just (hadn't really sunken in or) haven't quite gotten around to importing a locally pertinent CVS file of local activity into CHIRP, which I was pleasantly surprised to connect to and establish a serial/USB interface to the Baofeng's ROM routines. Well enough to use the software interface to "program in" a weather station, (past some MS VB updates, thankfully). For the 70cm band, the offset is typically 5 MHz, either + or -. Noted. As in as opposed to .6MHz offset delineator indicated on the prior bandwidth. Although, without a license, you will not be able to have any conversations, only listen. I'm all ears. The Bao Feng software is not very friendly, and you have to use the right version depending on the firmware version of the radio you have. This website may help you: http://www.miklor.com/ But of course. I'm well enough familiar with Chinglish to have at least found and immediately adopted CHIRP;- Mildor, I'll save, of course, along with your post in the odds&ends section, a directory where I'm collecting useful information. Signed, A licensed amateur radio operator Hey you. Appreciate your taking the time to point out a few discrepancies, the sites and offsets, notably. How about this replacement antenna, if you don't mind. (I'll look it up off that initial order.) Think it'll make much difference, or am short-stroking and better off looking to utilize a mast (as Paul mentioned) if I want to seriously consider any/much else reception-wise while inside my house? Anyway here it is...(please "pull," backspace the line below into one line for a valid link, keeping all characters intact. Sorry this Usenet reader craps when posting out more than an allotted characters per line to the server.) http://www.amazon.com /gp/product/B008P7YX4Y /ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 A big 10-4 & thanks again - -Flash FYI... amateur operators do not use 10 codes. We reserve those for our unlicensed 11 meter "friends". That antenna is likely to not be much better than the one that came with the radio. You might consider something along these lines: http://www.amazon.com/NAGOYA-NA-771-.../dp/B00BY3XN7E If you get serious about it, you will find a lot of good information he http://www.arrl.org/getting-licensed The question pools for all of the exams (along with the answers) are freely obtainable on the web. Out of several hundred questions, your examiners will give you 35 questions, in about 10 different topic areas. Like any hobby, it is what you make of it. I particularly enjoy the technical aspect of it, learning about radio propagation and electronics. Many of us enjoy having the ability to serve when disaster strikes; hams are usually the first ones called upon (after the emergency responders) to make sure communications are in place when everything else is off line. In the event of a zombie apocalypse (and other lesser disaster events) we'll be able to get messages back and forth across the country and the world. Others enjoy the social and fellowship aspect of it. Like any socially oriented activity, there is always the occasional dufus, but most hams are good people. There are ham clubs all over, you can use this to find a club in your area: http://www.arrl.org/find-a-club |
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