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How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]



 
 
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  #21  
Old October 10th 06, 08:22 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Mitch Crane
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Posts: 254
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

Joey wrote in :

You say, "search them physically"? I have to tell you that I don;'t
work in the sort of environment where that kind of behaviour is
considered acceptable!


Would an all nude work environment be acceptable? It would make hiding such
devices difficult so you wouldn't have to do anything untoward like
searching people.

--
ybbxvatyvxrnobeantnvayvivatyvxrnurergvpyvfgravatgb neguheyrrerpbeqfznxv
atnyylbhesevraqfsrryfbthvyglnobhggurveplavpvfznaqg urerfgbsgurvetrareng
vbaabgriragurtbireazragnertbaanfgbclbhabjohgnerlbh ernqlgborurnegoebxra
  #22  
Old October 10th 06, 11:33 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
atec77
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Posts: 4
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

Joey wrote:
On 10 Oct 2006, atec77 ""atec77 \"@ hotmail.com" wrote:

Joey wrote:
Suppose someone visited your office or home and tried to make a
voice recording using a hidden recorder.

If they used a older-style dictation machine based on tape then
you could detect the electromagnetic transmissions from the
dictation machine when it was recording.

But how would you detect if someone was secretly recording with an
MP3 player that recorded to flash memory?

Is there some transmission which could be detected?
Perhaps some low power ultra high frequency from chip refresh
cycles?


3 AM with the right equipment it would be findable , now are you
serious or just another one of "them"?



Nope, I am not one of "them". This is very much for real.

What is "3 AM".

Your kidding ?
do you read analogue clocks ?
  #23  
Old October 10th 06, 11:52 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
kony
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Posts: 7,416
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 15:51:51 +0100, Joey
wrote:


You say, "search them physically"? I have to tell you that I don;'t
work in the sort of environment where that kind of behaviour is
considered acceptable!



Then the only practical alternative remaining is to have
them consent to and go through a metal detector, and of
course it has to be actively manned to discriminate a
potential recorder from some other device, object, etc.

If you find what might be an MP player, you won't be able to
determine if it's recording, rather than playing, or if
recording off the radio. Unless MP3 players become
illegal devices, or at least clearly posted as banned on
private premises, you can't justify a search or seizure
either (depending on laws in your locale). If private
property, the other party may still refuse a search and
seizure attempt.

Even scanning for such a device's radiated energy at
entrance to an area, that wouldn't prevent them from turning
on the device later. Unless you have the expectation that
you can seize such equipment, you should follow the same
guidelines you should have otherwise- not saying anything of
importance in the presence of someone who can't be trusted
not to repeat, reproduce, etc., in any way.

Ultimately going to such extra lengths will tend to make
people suspect you have something to hide and put your
activities under more scrutiny.
  #24  
Old October 10th 06, 11:56 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Impmon
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Posts: 102
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 15:54:06 +0100, Joey wrote:

What is "3 AM".


On digital clock, it would read 3:00 and the PM indicator would be
off.

On analoug clock, the big hand would be pointing at 12 and small hand
at 3 and outside should be still dark (no sun)
--
When you hear the toilet flush, and hear the words "uh oh", it's already
too late. - by anonymous Mother in Austin, TX
Spam block in place, no emil reply is expected at all.
  #25  
Old October 11th 06, 12:03 AM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Joey
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Posts: 24
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

On 10 Oct 2006, Impmon wrote:

On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 15:54:06 +0100, Joey wrote:

What is "3 AM".


On digital clock, it would read 3:00 and the PM indicator would be
off.

On analoug clock, the big hand would be pointing at 12 and small hand
at 3 and outside should be still dark (no sun)



What are you doing? Water divining with the twig split 90 degrees? Or
searching for MP3 recorder output with the birch twig?
  #26  
Old October 11th 06, 12:21 AM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Joey
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Posts: 24
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

On 10 Oct 2006, Aly wrote:


Joey wrote in message
...
Suppose someone visited your office or home and tried to make a
voice recording using a hidden recorder.


Your only real option is to hold your meetings in the middle of
field, and for everyone to be naked.

Aside from that, unless you work for MI5 or have alot of money then
the above would be far easier. If it was that important you
wouldn't be asking the question here.g



Is that right?

Hear this radio programme (under 30 mins).
Use whichever protocol works best for you, both are the same.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/science/...eingbugged.ram
rtsp://rmv8.bbc.net.uk/radio4/science/beingbugged.ra
  #27  
Old October 11th 06, 12:22 AM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Joey
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Posts: 24
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

On 10 Oct 2006, kony wrote:

On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 15:51:51 +0100, Joey
wrote:


You say, "search them physically"? I have to tell you that I don;'t
work in the sort of environment where that kind of behaviour is
considered acceptable!



Then the only practical alternative remaining is to have
them consent to and go through a metal detector, and of
course it has to be actively manned to discriminate a
potential recorder from some other device, object, etc.

If you find what might be an MP player, you won't be able to
determine if it's recording, rather than playing, or if
recording off the radio. Unless MP3 players become
illegal devices, or at least clearly posted as banned on
private premises, you can't justify a search or seizure
either (depending on laws in your locale). If private
property, the other party may still refuse a search and
seizure attempt.

Even scanning for such a device's radiated energy at
entrance to an area, that wouldn't prevent them from turning
on the device later. Unless you have the expectation that
you can seize such equipment, you should follow the same
guidelines you should have otherwise- not saying anything of
importance in the presence of someone who can't be trusted
not to repeat, reproduce, etc., in any way.

Ultimately going to such extra lengths will tend to make
people suspect you have something to hide and put your
activities under more scrutiny.



Thanks Kony. So the MP3 recorder is essentially undetectable during its
operation. OK. Thanks.

Maybe that explains why I can't find any follow-on products for tape
recorder detection while many of the the older devices are no longer
available.
  #28  
Old October 11th 06, 01:44 AM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Slow Code
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Posts: 4
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]

Joey wrote in :

On 10 Oct 2006, Slow Code wrote:

Joey wrote in
:

Suppose someone visited your office or home and tried to make a
voice recording using a hidden recorder.

If they used a older-style dictation machine based on tape then
you could detect the electromagnetic transmissions from the
dictation machine when it was recording.

But how would you detect if someone was secretly recording with an
MP3 player that recorded to flash memory?

Is there some transmission which could be detected?
Perhaps some low power ultra high frequency from chip refresh
cycles?



There probably is a little electro magnetic energy leaving the
device, but what frequency would you try to find it on? Other
electronic things such as computers, printers, etc in the office
most likely emit far more RF noise than the MP3 device. It would be
hard to find it. Eventually, the power would run down and the
thing would stop recording. Someone would have to come by again
and pick up the recorder. So your best bet is to be on the lookout
for any suspicious recorder placement and pick up activity.

Or just buy a stereo for your office and play it real loud all the
time.

Maybe belch and fart a lot too.

SC


The situation I describe is where the MP3 plater/recorder is carried
by the person.



Well in that case, the farting and belching should work to keep them away
and presto, no recordings, but you'll have to live with the stinky smell.

SC
  #29  
Old October 11th 06, 02:40 AM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
an old freind
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Posts: 2
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]


Slow Code wrote:
Joey wrote in :

On 10 Oct 2006, Slow Code wrote:



Well in that case, the farting and belching should work to keep them away
and presto, no recordings, but you'll have to live with the stinky smell.


help ham radio SC turn in your license

SC


  #30  
Old October 11th 06, 03:36 AM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,sci.electronics.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Ken Maltby
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Posts: 544
Default How detect if MP3 player is recording in your room? [OT]


"Joey" wrote in message
...
"Joey" wrote in message

Suppose someone visited your office or home and tried to make a
voice recording using a hidden recorder.

If they used a older-style dictation machine based on tape then
you could detect the electromagnetic transmissions from the
dictation machine when it was recording.

But how would you detect if someone was secretly recording with an
MP3 player that recorded to flash memory?

Is there some transmission which could be detected?
Perhaps some low power ultra high frequency from chip refresh
cycles?


On 10 Oct 2006, Ken Maltby wrote:

What is done is to generate a pattern of sound, only
part of which is audible, and then detect the low level
IF and RF that any sound equipment emits. Then follow
the signal detected to its source.

Luck;
Ken



Generate a pattern of sound part of which is inaudible?

Acoustic energy then, what the microphone/audio detection
picks up. (It will cover more frequencies that humans can
hear.)

The pattern is on at a particular time then off, it varies in
certain ways that will enable further analysis of any:
IF and RF?

Intermediate Frequencies (IF) or Radio Frequencies (RF)
given off by a device reacting to the pattern of sound.
If there is any IF or RF detected that corresponds/matches
the on off times of the pattern of sound, you know there is
a device responding to the sound in the room.

A more sophisticated analysis of the detected response
to the pattern, can provide a great deal of information
about the device detected. That would be beyond the
scope of your question, and your security clearance, as
well.

Luck;
Ken


 




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