WIll I be OK with an AMD64 3400+?

"kony" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 01:39:14 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:



Errrm....I think we are playing with voltage rails here (might be wrong
though)
I was under the impression that most CPU cores run at lower voltages as
the
frequencies get higher, I would imagine a CPU clocking at 3MHz on a 12V
circuit could double as a central heating system :O))
I understand the core voltage for an AMD64 is around 1.5 volts.

All you appear too be saying is that the PSU's are badly designed!!

No we're saying you lack a basic understanding of computer
power and are unfit to judge the situation.

Sounds more like you.

If you go on like this without bothering to check your
facts, it will be akin to trollism.

Again that sounds more like you.

"kony" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 22:13:36 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:


"kony" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 14:24:22 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:

Still a fair bit though 450 Wis half a small electric fire
a considerble energy cost even if not running at max power.



As already mentioned, you have no relative expectation based
on the "450W" figure. It is primarily to support the high #
of amps on the 12V rail that modern systems use at peak or
full load.

I doubt many CPU's cores run at 12V and that is where most
of the energy is spent.


What you mean is "you don't know".
They do run off the PSU 12V rail. If you had bothered to
check, this would have been obvious. Not ALL CPUs derive
power from the 12V rail as older motherboards in particular
used 5V rail instead but today, most do use 12V which is
stepped down on the motherboard. Didn't it seem a wee bit
odd that no ATX supply outputs anywhere near 1.5V that CPUs
use? Ever wonder why? Too high a current.

As I said no CPU core that I know of has a core voltage of
12 volts.
I fail to see why you are disputing this.







If you're that concerned about energy usage or energy cost,
don't buy it- simple as that.

I am concerned about energy waste 450 is too much for
a computer.If you buy badly designed wasteful computers
that is what you are encouraging them to produce/


Then don't buy it, and don't pretend you know more than you
do, since they aren't using 450W from a 450W PSU. Since
you're just clueless, you are unfit to judge whether we are
buying badly designed computers or not.

You would do well to just STFU until you know a bit more
than you do.

Says the guy who thinks CPU core run at 12 volts.
You are not fooling anyone bar yourself, and thats hardly
an achievement.

"kony" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 22:13:36 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:

As already mentioned, you have no relative expectation based
on the "450W" figure. It is primarily to support the high #
of amps on the 12V rail that modern systems use at peak or
full load.

450 W is what the unit is designed to supply, I don't think it
matters which rail as it is not specified.

You don't think so because you dont' know much about the PSU

More than you do.

market nor how a computer uses power yet. If you'd stop
guessing and accumulate a few facts first, you'd be getting
closer to understanding.




If you're that concerned about energy usage or energy cost,
don't buy it- simple as that.

I want to miniimise it, it would be daft to consider it an all or
nithing issue. Excessive power consumption is down to bad design
IMO. If you buy badly designed proessors you are only
ecouraging them to produce more.

Then minimize it. Who's stopping you? Surely you know how?
We do. If you think the design is bad, buy something else-
surely if you feel you can claim the design is "bad", you
MUST then have an alternative in mind that is better else no
contrast could be made.

I do, do you want to buy the copyright?


Buy what you want, but right now you're just wasting time.

On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 14:31:53 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:


What you mean is "you don't know".
They do run off the PSU 12V rail. If you had bothered to
check, this would have been obvious. Not ALL CPUs derive
power from the 12V rail as older motherboards in particular
used 5V rail instead but today, most do use 12V which is
stepped down on the motherboard. Didn't it seem a wee bit
odd that no ATX supply outputs anywhere near 1.5V that CPUs
use? Ever wonder why? Too high a current.

As I said no CPU core that I know of has a core voltage of
12 volts.
I fail to see why you are disputing this.

I don't need to "dispute" your made up nonsense. The issue
was of which PSU rail is used for CPU power, and if you had
bothered to learn a bit before pretending to know, you'd
have realized it. Some things are such basic and common
knowledge that I'm not going to continually argue about
them, but if you check AMD or Intel's datasheets it is clear
enough, even with your basic inability to understand the
technology involved.



You would do well to just STFU until you know a bit more
than you do.

Says the guy who thinks CPU core run at 12 volts.
You are not fooling anyone bar yourself, and thats hardly
an achievement.

I guess you just don't get it. I'll type real slow for you:

The power supply's 12V rail supplies the power to a
step-down regulation circuit on the motherboard. That
circuit reduces the 12V to a lower voltage, like 1.5V or
whatever the CPU uses. I never implied the CPU vCore is
12V, only that the 12V rail from the PSU that used for CPU
power, because it _IS_, on most modern boards, while older
boards more often used 5V rail from the PSU (also mentioned
previously but you seem to need everything repeated till it
sinks in).

On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 14:36:15 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:


"kony" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 22:13:36 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:

As already mentioned, you have no relative expectation based
on the "450W" figure. It is primarily to support the high #
of amps on the 12V rail that modern systems use at peak or
full load.

450 W is what the unit is designed to supply, I don't think it
matters which rail as it is not specified.

You don't think so because you dont' know much about the PSU

More than you do.



LOL.

OK, whatever you say.

Emperor's New Widescreen wrote:
"kony" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 22:13:36 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:

As already mentioned, you have no relative expectation based
on the "450W" figure. It is primarily to support the high #
of amps on the 12V rail that modern systems use at peak or
full load.

450 W is what the unit is designed to supply, I don't think it
matters which rail as it is not specified.

You don't think so because you dont' know much about the PSU

More than you do.

LOL!! Thanks for that, I needed a laugh. As if a mouth-breather like you,
someone who has repeatedly proven he can't grasp the most basic of concepts,
even when they're explained in detail, could ever hope to know a 100th of
what Kony knows about what is his field of expertise, a man who knows more
than I do and I've been building computers for over 10 years.
--
~misfit~

Emperor's New Widescreen wrote:
"kony" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 01:39:14 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:



Errrm....I think we are playing with voltage rails here (might be
wrong though)
I was under the impression that most CPU cores run at lower
voltages as the frequencies get higher, I would imagine a CPU
clocking at 3MHz on a 12V circuit could double as a central heating
system :O))
I understand the core voltage for an AMD64 is around 1.5 volts.

All you appear too be saying is that the PSU's are badly designed!!

No we're saying you lack a basic understanding of computer
power and are unfit to judge the situation.

Sounds more like you.

If you go on like this without bothering to check your
facts, it will be akin to trollism.

Again that sounds more like you.

LOL, I *was* right! Showing your true colours now huh? It's obvious you
didn't really want advice. You're just a weak person who doesn't have the
courage of his own convictions and came here hoping that at least someone
would tell him he wasn't making a mistake in buying out-dated, end-of-line,
crappy equipment. When someone who has infinitly more knowledge on the
subject than you ever will tries to advise you where you're going wrong you
get abusive. Typical "little man" syndrome. You feel threatened when
reminded how little you really know.

This whole thread reads like educators trying to get it through to the
mentally challenged kid how things work. Now the menatlly challenged kid
(that's you BTW in case you're too obtuse to work out the analogy) starts
throwing his books around.

Go away and buy your outdated POS. Stop bothering the grown-ups. Kony says
it like it is and obviously you are incapable of hearing the truth or taking
constructive criticism on board.

Buh-bye now.
--
~misfit~

"~misfit~" wrote in message
...
Emperor's New Widescreen wrote:
"kony" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 01:39:14 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:



Errrm....I think we are playing with voltage rails here (might be
wrong though)
I was under the impression that most CPU cores run at lower
voltages as the frequencies get higher, I would imagine a CPU
clocking at 3MHz on a 12V circuit could double as a central heating
system :O))
I understand the core voltage for an AMD64 is around 1.5 volts.

All you appear too be saying is that the PSU's are badly designed!!

No we're saying you lack a basic understanding of computer
power and are unfit to judge the situation.

Sounds more like you.

If you go on like this without bothering to check your
facts, it will be akin to trollism.

Again that sounds more like you.

LOL, I *was* right! Showing your true colours now huh? It's obvious you
didn't really want advice. You're just a weak person who doesn't have the
courage of his own convictions and came here hoping that at least someone
would tell him he wasn't making a mistake in buying out-dated,
end-of-line,
crappy equipment. When someone who has infinitly more knowledge on the
subject than you ever will tries to advise you where you're going wrong
you
get abusive. Typical "little man" syndrome. You feel threatened when
reminded how little you really know.

This whole thread reads like educators trying to get it through to the
mentally challenged kid how things work. Now the menatlly challenged kid
(that's you BTW in case you're too obtuse to work out the analogy) starts
throwing his books around.

Go away and buy your outdated POS. Stop bothering the grown-ups. Kony says
it like it is and obviously you are incapable of hearing the truth or
taking
constructive criticism on board.

Buh-bye now.
--
~misfit~

Well your obviously chose you name prudently but lets just look at the fact.

Here is the statement I made
"I doubt many CPU's cores run at 12V and that is where most of the energy is
spent."


And here is your reply
"Actually, in the case of power supplies, you're wrong"

So you are saying that CPU cores run at 12V, well I think you have lost
all credibility there.

You then try to back track and say it actually takes a regulated voltage
voltage from the motherboard. I didn't say anything about power supplies
all I mentioned was the CPU's core volotage which is not 12 volts,
discussing power suppplies is irrelevant to the CPU core voltage.

Discussing computer power supply design is rather irrelevent as most
people can't see futher than the end of their nose and are incapable
of realising that the cheap badly designed computer they buy will
cost them more in the long run.
Manufacturers realise most people are as thick as two short planks
and thus produce systems which will keep them happy (at least in the
short term), short term profit is their only motive, any dip in short term
sales and they are out on their arses so who can blame them?

"~misfit~" wrote in message
...
Emperor's New Widescreen wrote:
"kony" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 22:13:36 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:

As already mentioned, you have no relative expectation based
on the "450W" figure. It is primarily to support the high #
of amps on the 12V rail that modern systems use at peak or
full load.

450 W is what the unit is designed to supply, I don't think it
matters which rail as it is not specified.

You don't think so because you dont' know much about the PSU

More than you do.

LOL!! Thanks for that, I needed a laugh. As if a mouth-breather like you,
someone who has repeatedly proven he can't grasp the most basic of
concepts,
even when they're explained in detail, could ever hope to know a 100th of
what Kony knows about what is his field of expertise, a man who knows more
than I do and I've been building computers for over 10 years.

I actually have a degree in electronics a slightly higher qualification than
ten
year experience assembling computers I would imagine.

I did say I couuld design a better PSU for a computer and I believe I am
correct I saying that.

I can't be arsed to do it right now because quite frankly I have better and
less boring things to do.

Just because PSU's are as they are does not mean they are suitable, it just
means they are cheap (to make). They guy who sells you the PSU doesn't
give a t*ss how much power is wasted in its use, afterall he don't pay for
that
*you* do. The same goes for other electrical devices such as washing
machines
and fridges, the manufacturer knows they money you save by having a cheap
PSU/motor will soon be lost in the power you waste whilst using it.
HE ain't going to tell you that though becasue he knows most people are
just to plain uninformed to realise that and simply buy the model with the
lowest price tag rather than the one which will cost him less overall.




--
~misfit~

"kony" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 14:36:15 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:


"kony" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 22:13:36 GMT, "Emperor's New Widescreen"
wrote:

As already mentioned, you have no relative expectation based
on the "450W" figure. It is primarily to support the high #
of amps on the 12V rail that modern systems use at peak or
full load.

450 W is what the unit is designed to supply, I don't think it
matters which rail as it is not specified.

You don't think so because you dont' know much about the PSU

More than you do.



LOL.

Yes laugh you might know more about the PSU's on the market,
you probably don't realise they cheap badly designed units unsutable
for the job they do.
There is a difference between knowledge and intelligence,
I have both, you have the (some) of the former.
You probaly have more knowledge of badly designed syetem than I
do thouogh, however it is not an area of great interest to me.
It is something which annoys me more than fascinates me.

OK, whatever you say.