SATA controller hot swap?

I was trying to set up a network storage box and I have a question about
what SATA controller I might need.

I'm looking at an Asus P5RD1-V motherboard and it has 4 onboard SATA
channels. I want to hot-swap the drives though, and cannot find anything in
the documentation that says whether I can do that or not.

I have hot swap bays for the drives, but is that all I need? Is whether or
not you can hot swap a drive dependent on the physical connections (which I
have covered) or is it a feature that the controller must support?

My confusion comes in because the SATA spec says that SATA is
hot-swappable... so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able
to have drives swapped?

Of course, this comes down to a money issue. I have a motherboard with SATA
onboard, but do I really need to buy a $300 card on top of that to hot-swap?

--
Shawn Wilson

Shawn Wilson wrote

I was trying to set up a network storage box and I have a question about what
SATA controller I might need.

I'm looking at an Asus P5RD1-V motherboard and it has 4 onboard SATA channels.
I want to hot-swap the drives though, and cannot find
anything in the documentation that says whether I can do that or not.

Its part of the SATA standard, so you always can.

I have hot swap bays for the drives, but is that all I need?

That part is just for mechanical convenience, and yes, thats all you need.

Is whether or not you can hot swap a drive dependent on the physical
connections (which I have covered) or is it a feature that the controller must
support?

Nope, its part of the SATA standard.

My confusion comes in because the SATA spec says that SATA is hot-swappable...

Correct.

so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able to have drives
swapped?

Yes, and that's why Asus doesnt say anything about it, it comes with SATA.

Of course, this comes down to a money issue. I have a motherboard with SATA
onboard, but do I really need to buy a $300 card on top of that to hot-swap?

Nope.

"Rod Speed" wrote
Shawn Wilson wrote

so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able to have drives
swapped?

Yes, and that's why Asus doesnt say anything about it, it comes with SATA.

So would it be 'safe' to buy any SATA controller and expect it to work?

The thing that gets me is simply that when I look for say 4 port cards, I
find a no-name card for $22, a HighPoint card for $88, and a Promise card
for $209 that don't mention hot-swap. Then I find a $288 Adaptec and a $300
3ware that specifically mentions hot-swap. That suggests to me that there
is something 'special' about those controllers. Now, maybe that's just the
lemming 'get what you pay for' in me, but what drives a card from $22 to
$300?

Besides what company one might like better or expect better support from,
why is there such a huge price difference if they all do the same thing?
(and by the same thing I mean having 4 ports, raid 0/1/0+1, and presumably
hot-swap)

When I look at RAM I can buy Kingston valueram for $100 or Crucial for $150
(hypathetically) and know that if the cas timings are the same I'm simply
paying for quality and potential longevity. That price difference makes
sense. The price difference on SATA controllers does not, at least not to
me.

Lastly, most of the 8 port cards are 64bit cards. I only have 32bit PCI
available. Someone said they'll still work... is that true?

--
Shawn Wilson

I was trying to set up a network storage box and I have a question about
what SATA controller I might need.

I'm looking at an Asus P5RD1-V motherboard and it has 4 onboard SATA
channels. I want to hot-swap the drives though, and cannot find anything
in
the documentation that says whether I can do that or not.

I have hot swap bays for the drives, but is that all I need? Is whether
or
not you can hot swap a drive dependent on the physical connections (which
I
have covered) or is it a feature that the controller must support?

My confusion comes in because the SATA spec says that SATA is
hot-swappable... so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able
to have drives swapped?

Of course, this comes down to a money issue. I have a motherboard with
SATA
onboard, but do I really need to buy a $300 card on top of that to
hot-swap?

It is like asking, is SCSI hot-swappable?
Yes and no. Depends on particular implementation.
And on the meaning of "hot-swappable".

Provide more details for more accurate answer.

"Shawn Wilson" wrote:
The thing that gets me is simply that when I look for say 4 port cards, I
find a no-name card for $22, a HighPoint card for $88, and a Promise card
for $209 that don't mention hot-swap. Then I find a $288 Adaptec and a $300
3ware that specifically mentions hot-swap. That suggests to me that there
is something 'special' about those controllers. Now, maybe that's just the
lemming 'get what you pay for' in me, but what drives a card from $22 to
$300?
[.........]
Lastly, most of the 8 port cards are 64bit cards. I only have 32bit PCI
available. Someone said they'll still work... is that true?


Call the manufacturers and ask them. Better yet, email them.
At least with email, you'll have a trail, and they'll know it.

*TimDaniels*

Shawn Wilson wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Shawn Wilson wrote

so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able to have drives
swapped?

Yes, and that's why Asus doesnt say anything about it, it comes with SATA.

So would it be 'safe' to buy any SATA controller and expect it to work?

Yep, the hot swap capability is just the mechanical detail and OS support.

The thing that gets me is simply that when I look for say 4 port
cards, I find a no-name card for $22, a HighPoint card for $88, and a Promise
card for $209 that don't mention hot-swap.

Basicallly because hot swap is part of the SATA standard.

Then I find a $288 Adaptec and a $300 3ware that specifically mentions
hot-swap. That suggests to me that there is something 'special' about those
controllers.

It shouldnt, because hot swap is part of the SATA standard.

Now, maybe that's just the lemming 'get what you pay
for' in me, but what drives a card from $22 to $300?

Various other capabilitys like RAID and the inevitable
price you always pay for the brand name products.

Besides what company one might like better or expect better support from, why
is there such a huge price difference if they all do the same thing?

They dont, some have RAID better implemented than others etc.

And the cheapest SATA support is obviously with the motherboard.

(and by the same thing I mean having 4 ports, raid 0/1/0+1, and presumably
hot-swap)

When I look at RAM I can buy Kingston valueram for $100 or Crucial for $150
(hypathetically) and know that if the cas timings are the same I'm simply
paying for quality and potential longevity. That price difference makes
sense.

I dont believe it does myself and dont bother with either of them.

The price difference on SATA controllers does not, at least not to me.

Its more that the highest priced SATA controllers arent used by
many and so there has to be a price premium for that reason alone.

Lastly, most of the 8 port cards are 64bit cards. I only have 32bit PCI
available. Someone said they'll still work... is that true?

You said your motherboard supports SATA, so why do you need a card at all ?

"Shawn Wilson" wrote in message
I was trying to set up a network storage box and I have a question about
what SATA controller I might need.

I'm looking at an Asus P5RD1-V motherboard and it has 4 onboard SATA
channels. I want to hot-swap the drives though, and cannot find anything in
the documentation that says whether I can do that or not.

I have hot swap bays for the drives, but is that all I need? Is whether or
not you can hot swap a drive dependent on the physical connections (which I
have covered) or is it a feature that the controller must support?

And driver and OS as well.


My confusion comes in because the SATA spec says that SATA is hot-swappable...

so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able to have drives swapped?

Since it doesn't have latches that activate and prevent you from physically swapping
the drive that probably just means that there is a mechanism in place that the driver
can pickup on and notify the OS and applications that a drive was disconnected
(or re-connected).

Whether drive swap is actually working depends on whether the card's driver
dynamically reports a swap and how the applications and OS react on that.


Of course, this comes down to a money issue. I have a motherboard with SATA
onboard, but do I really need to buy a $300 card on top of that to hot-swap?

"Rod Speed" wrote in message
Shawn Wilson wrote

I was trying to set up a network storage box and I have a question about what
SATA controller I might need.

I'm looking at an Asus P5RD1-V motherboard and it has 4 onboard SATA channels.
I want to hot-swap the drives though, and cannot find
anything in the documentation that says whether I can do that or not.

Its part of the SATA standard, so you always can.

Nonsense. SCSI is hotswap too but not all SCSI support it.


I have hot swap bays for the drives, but is that all I need?

That part is just for mechanical convenience, and yes, thats all you need.

Is whether or not you can hot swap a drive dependent on the physical
connections (which I have covered) or is it a feature that the controller must
support?

Nope, its part of the SATA standard.

My confusion comes in because the SATA spec says that SATA is hot-swappable...

Correct.

so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able to have drives
swapped?

Yes, and that's why Asus doesnt say anything about it, it comes with SATA.

Of course, this comes down to a money issue. I have a motherboard with SATA
onboard, but do I really need to buy a $300 card on top of that to hot-swap?

Nope.

"Shawn Wilson" wrote in message
m...

So would it be 'safe' to buy any SATA controller and expect it to work?

The thing that gets me is simply that when I look for say 4 port cards, I
find a no-name card for $22, a HighPoint card for $88, and a Promise card
for $209 that don't mention hot-swap. Then I find a $288 Adaptec and a $300
3ware that specifically mentions hot-swap. That suggests to me that there
is something 'special' about those controllers. Now, maybe that's just the
lemming 'get what you pay for' in me, but what drives a card from $22 to
$300?

Anything under $50 is SATA1, and does not have hot-swap or NCQ.

SATA2 cards are generally PCI-X, often 64-bit. The driver support for
SATA2 features like hot-swap add to the cost. The cheapest cards are
probably have the SiI chips, which you can look up at siliconimage.com.

Besides what company one might like better or expect better support from,
why is there such a huge price difference if they all do the same thing?
(and by the same thing I mean having 4 ports, raid 0/1/0+1, and presumably
hot-swap)

SATA2 cards are for the server market, and support adds to the cost.

When I look at RAM I can buy Kingston valueram for $100 or Crucial for $150
(hypathetically) and know that if the cas timings are the same I'm simply
paying for quality and potential longevity. That price difference makes
sense. The price difference on SATA controllers does not, at least not to
me.

Lastly, most of the 8 port cards are 64bit cards. I only have 32bit PCI
available. Someone said they'll still work... is that true?

Yes, if the PCI slots are not keyed for 5V.

Folkert Rienstra wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Shawn Wilson wrote

I was trying to set up a network storage box and I have
a question about what SATA controller I might need.

I'm looking at an Asus P5RD1-V motherboard and it has 4 onboard
SATA channels. I want to hot-swap the drives though, and cannot find
anything in the documentation that says whether I can do that or not.

Its part of the SATA standard, so you always can.

Nonsense. SCSI is hotswap too but not all SCSI support it.

Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you cant
even manage a viable troll, or anything else at all, either.

I have hot swap bays for the drives, but is that all I need?

That part is just for mechanical convenience, and yes, thats all you
need.

Is whether or not you can hot swap a drive dependent on the physical
connections (which I have covered) or is it a feature that the
controller must support?

Nope, its part of the SATA standard.

My confusion comes in because the SATA spec says that SATA is
hot-swappable...

Correct.

so shouldn't every controller follow the spec and be able to have
drives swapped?

Yes, and that's why Asus doesnt say anything about it, it comes with
SATA.

Of course, this comes down to a money issue. I have a motherboard
with SATA onboard, but do I really need to buy a $300 card on top
of that to hot-swap?

Nope.