Nvidia GeForce 7600GS finally out for AGP

On 13 Aug 2006 22:21:40 -0700, "pc games"
wrote:

wrote:

But you most have a Hole in your head to even think of
VISTA, its just DRM plus more DRM..

So what other choice do I have to play PC Games?

WinXP should be good for you for the next 5 years. After all, you are
still using Win 98. And since you seem to be a foolish and
non-discriminatory shopper, throwing away money on mediocre game
titles, such as Prey, I doubt if you will be able to afford
Dx10 hardware for the next couple of years anyway.

John Lewis

I do agree, as long as we have a monopoly it will never be
good to consumers.
But the only thing from MS I use is the OS itself cause again
I don't have any choice but besides that I don't use anything
else from MS.
All other software I use it non-MS... like OpenOffice, Winamp
ZoneAlarm, Firefox etc...
Games its even easier cause they gave up publishing anything
for the PC platform.
So the only thing that is worrying me now is how Vista will be
protected... so will see new year
Like I always say... if the PC Gaming industry switch all
together to Linux I will immediately follow with a big smile

ScottL wrote:

I missed the first part of this thread, but if you're talking
about legitimate copies of games, why are you against
selling them? There's absolutely no reason why you
shouldn't. Computer games are no different than books,
audio CDs, videos or any other kind of media: you have
every right to sell copies you legally buy. It's called "first
use right" in the U.S.

The Boycott I've made to the 2nd hand market has nothing to
do with "rights"... I want those rights to still exist but
now cause of the "health" of PC Game I choosed in freedom
not do
My decision is only based on the health of the PC Game market
which is not very good.
Every year the PC Game market has had lower sales.
Every year the PC Game platform has losed market share to
consoles.
Every year we have saw PC Game developers closing.
Every year we have saw PC Game publishers leaving.
Every year we have seen less and less releases.
Every year we have seen more and more titles canceled.
Every year we have saw how piracy has been so damaging to
sales.
Every year we have saw how casual copying (lending amoung
friends) has been so damaging to sales.
With so many going against the PC Game market specially
the so needed profits developers need to survive and stay
in business and them in a desperate move starting to use
abusive and intrusive copy-protection means I've made the
desision to boycott (at least for now) the 2nd hand market
for PC Games, cause don't forget that market doesn't give
any financial reward to the developers.
Any game that is bought or sold in the 2nd hand market has
no money going to the developers, and its the developers
the most important thing in the PC Game market.

I want the freedom to be there, the freedom to use the 2nd
hand market, I just don't want to use it in a time of
crisis, in a time where PC Games need support and protection

ScottL wrote:

Here was my experience:

1. Purchased HL2 Game of the Year Edition.

2. Brought it home, installed it, Steam went online for the activation
and began an automatic update without any prompt whatsoever.

3. I waited. And waited. And waited some more. Finally I left it
running overnight. It was 85% complete when I went to bed, and
87% done when I woke up -- SIX HOURS LATER.

4. Paused the download (I had other things to get done online)
and started doing some research. Found out I should set all games
other than HL2 to not update automatically (the updates were
occurring on HL2, CS:S, Lost Coast etc simultaneously). Ok fine.

5. Resumed updating HL2 before I went to bed that night. It went
from 87% to 96% in another six hours. STILL wasn't complete,
and I STILL couldn't play any of the damned games.

6. It finally finished updating after the third night, and I still haven't
had the time to finish updating any of the other games. When I
try to play them I get a "this game is not ready" message.

Beyond absurd.

Scott thank you very much for this testimony.
I really appreciate it.

Rob wrote:

I've been avoiding replying to you Rob
But you are pushing me man
What is your deal?
Why are you provoking me like this?
I've already said to you, when it comes to STEAM you bring
very very little to the discussion.
So whats your deal?

Yet, there is only *one* way to play Half-Life 2, and
that is via STEAM. You aggressively attack anybody that
does that, claiming that they are hurting gamers like
you. Even though they don't have a choice if they want to
play HL2. Why don't you boycott XP like you tell
everybody to boycott STEAM? " Vote with your wallet" has
become your pet saying. Why aren't you adhering to your
own mantra? One rule for you and one rule for everyone
else eh?

Please tell me what I should do?
Stop using Windows? Is that it? Is that what you implying?
So cause I'm against STEAM and there are obvious similarities
in MS and Valve practices, then that means I should stop
using Windows? Which means stop playing PC Games?
Do you think you are the first to say this to me?
STEAM LOVERs have been telling me this all along to leave PC
Games
You question Valve, you refuse to accept STEAM so you should
leave PC Games...
Can't you do any better than this?

You harp on about Prey and the fact that it is likely to
have its copy protection patched out, citing this as a
good thing. Did you know that it might be replaced by a
simple click through "yes/no" screen asking you to agree
to the EULA before playing? Imagine, you'll have to "ask
for permission" to play it every time, just like you say
people have to with Half-Life 2.

Did you follow this group back in June when there was official
information that Prey would have Product Activation?
Fortunately later Human Head and 3D Realms backed from their
planned use of Product Activation in Prey, but before we had
the confirmation Prey did not have Product Activation I did
in fact created 5 new threads in 2 consecutive days complain
about it and preparing everyone for the fight we had to face
And yes many STEAM LOVERs started to complain against me and
saying I was spamming the group, and now you dare questioning
me about not dealing with Prey the same way I dealt with HL2?
If Prey had Product Activation I would have bought ZERO! ZERO
units! NONE! NONE!
If Prey had Product Activation I would have complained against
it probably even more actively than HL2!
It doesn't matter what the game or who done it, I simply will
not accept any Product Activation from anyone!

Will you say that's humiliating and stop playing and
promoting Prey and any mission packs/follow-ups? Of
course you won't, because you're a hypocrite.

Lies and insults...
Is this the best you can do?
Did you have a bad day yesterday?
So what do I have to do with it?
Insults Rob?
Lies Rob?

Interesting that before you decided to talk about STEAM you
were a cool dude with lots of great stuff to talk about...
you were probably my favorite poster, the one I most enjoyed
reading, I even tried corresponding with you by email although
you didn't seem very interested... but now? now you insult and
you lie just like a STEAM LOVER

Yet more hypocrisy. You don't want people to use STEAM
because people like you, without Broadband, will get left
behind. Yet you'll happily jump to Linux even if it
means a large number of gamers get "left behind". So long
as you're OK, you don't actually care, do you?

Please read the thread I just created some days ago called
"How could Linux save PC Games"

What I propose?
Simple...
Developers and publisher start doing Linux based games and
selling them the same way that PC Games are... the same
price of preferably cheaper, in Retail stores in DVD-ROM.
All PC Games made for Linux have a the OS inside the games
DVD disk itself, so no need to buy or install anything.
All PCs now have the capability of booting from a DVD-ROM
So what are the requirements for playing Linux based PC
Games in my proposal?
Having a PC, buying a Linux based game, and booting your
PC with the DVD disk from the game which has a mini Linux
boot that has everything to run that game.
Like I also say in my proposal, saved games and config
files must all be written in file systems used by windows
so nobody has the necessity to format anything or mess
up the system they already have or even install anything.
Now tell me who is excluded from this?
Who is excluded?

With this reply you gave me, a reply full or lies and
specially insults you again gave me reasons to say you are
not bringing anything new to the STEAM discussion and
unfortunately this time you started with insults...
Why?
Obviously the insults represents your frustration in not
having viable arguments.

I'm sorry this all happened cause I did respect you, but
not anymore... that time has passed... you now are another
STEAM LOVER, insulting, liar, disrespectful and fanatical
defender of greedy monopolistic arrogant Valve.
For now on I will no longer be afraid to lose you as a
fellow poster in a heated discussion about STEAM cause I
just did...

"pc games" wrote in message oups.com...
ScottL wrote:

I missed the first part of this thread, but if you're talking
about legitimate copies of games, why are you against
selling them? There's absolutely no reason why you
shouldn't. Computer games are no different than books,
audio CDs, videos or any other kind of media: you have
every right to sell copies you legally buy. It's called "first
use right" in the U.S.

The Boycott I've made to the 2nd hand market has nothing to
do with "rights"... I want those rights to still exist but
now cause of the "health" of PC Game I choosed in freedom
not do
My decision is only based on the health of the PC Game market
which is not very good.
Every year the PC Game market has had lower sales.
Every year the PC Game platform has losed market share to
consoles.
Every year we have saw PC Game developers closing.
Every year we have saw PC Game publishers leaving.
Every year we have seen less and less releases.
Every year we have seen more and more titles canceled.
Every year we have saw how piracy has been so damaging to
sales.
Every year we have saw how casual copying (lending amoung
friends) has been so damaging to sales.
With so many going against the PC Game market specially
the so needed profits developers need to survive and stay
in business and them in a desperate move starting to use
abusive and intrusive copy-protection means I've made the
desision to boycott (at least for now) the 2nd hand market
for PC Games, cause don't forget that market doesn't give
any financial reward to the developers.
Any game that is bought or sold in the 2nd hand market has
no money going to the developers, and its the developers
the most important thing in the PC Game market.

I want the freedom to be there, the freedom to use the 2nd
hand market, I just don't want to use it in a time of
crisis, in a time where PC Games need support and protection

Sorry but I don't see any crisis here. Have you checked
the recent financials of PC game developers? Most of them
are making money hand over fist, and the ones who aren't
are losing money because they're producing poor quality
products, not because of console games, or pirating etc.

And most of your other assumptions are equally absurd.
"Every year we have seen less and less releases"????
That's unqualified nonsense. If you want to use Valve as
one example among many, they've been releasing more
and more titles every year, not less.

On 14 Aug 2006 23:24:54 -0700, "pc games"
wrote:

Rob wrote:

I've been avoiding replying to you Rob
But you are pushing me man
What is your deal?
Why are you provoking me like this?

You need to learn to be able to discuss things without taking offence
so easily lad. Lighten up and get over yourself.

How do you get through life in a world where only your opinions count?
Do you constantly walk round with your fingers in your ears loudly
signing "la la la I can't hear you" ?

I've already said to you, when it comes to STEAM you bring
very very little to the discussion.
So whats your deal?

I can discuss STEAM because I have used it. You have never used it yet
talk about it like you're an expert on it. Yet you say I bring little
to a discussion on it?

I state my opinions based on facts that I have established for myself
through use and experimentation. You base your crazy outbursts on
hearsay and your own hysteria.

Please tell me what I should do?
Stop using Windows? Is that it? Is that what you implying?
So cause I'm against STEAM and there are obvious similarities
in MS and Valve practices, then that means I should stop
using Windows? Which means stop playing PC Games?
Do you think you are the first to say this to me?

You don't need to stop using *anything*. You just need to stop jumping
all over people in this group that use STEAM because they have no
choice if they want to play a game. Just like you with XP. It makes
you look like a hypocrite and you embarrass yourself in the process.

STEAM LOVERs have been telling me this all along to leave PC
Games

And there you go again. Why the sneering, condescending attitude to
people that use STEAM? Are you a MICROSOFT LOVER just because you use
XP to play your games? No, of course you're not. You're just an
average gamer that's stuck with certain things like the rest of us.

You question Valve, you refuse to accept STEAM so you should
leave PC Games...
Can't you do any better than this?

Absolutely I can deny it. People are just throwing back in your face
all the things that you sling around at people that use STEAM. The
only way to avoid STEAM is to not play HL2. A lot of people want to
play that game so they had to accept it. Just like you've had to
accept XP. One rule for you, another for everyone else.


Did you follow this group back in June when there was official
information that Prey would have Product Activation?

I have been following this group for 4 years. I have been posting for
around 3 years on and off. Just because I use a name that seems new to
the group, doesn't mean that I actually am. I have read your sensible
and constructive threads and I've read all of your crazy outbursts
from all of your nyms.

And yes many STEAM LOVERs started to complain against me and
saying I was spamming the group, and now you dare questioning
me about not dealing with Prey the same way I dealt with HL2?
If Prey had Product Activation I would have bought ZERO! ZERO
units! NONE! NONE!

Another bout of sneering condescension and a rant at the end of it. Do
never wonder why most people have you kill-filed? Most of the audience
that you try to preach to don't even see your messages because your
communication skills suck. You come across like an angsty teenager
with a rampant acne problem.

"STEAM LOVERS" as you so sneeringly insist on calling them are your
fellow gamers. They just got fed up with your aggressive attitude
towards everything and everybody that you don't agree with. Nothing
more.


Lies and insults...

Are you going to say that you've never told a single lie in this group
nor never insulted anybody? What about continuously sneering at
people, capitalising "STEAM LOVERS" to ram home your point? What about
spreading FUD about HL2, cross-posting to as many groups as you can to
spread your lies about how long it takes to install the game?

Is this the best you can do?
Did you have a bad day yesterday?
So what do I have to do with it?
Insults Rob?
Lies Rob?

Water off of a ducks back lad. I spent plenty of time trying to engage
you in adult debate about this. You merely stuck your fingers in your
ears and ignored anybody that tried to reason with you. You just
carried on spreading the FUD about something you've never used and
know absolutely nothing about.

Interesting that before you decided to talk about STEAM you
were a cool dude with lots of great stuff to talk about...

That's nothing to do with me and everything to do with your insane
prejudice against STEAM. It's blinded you to all reason. It should be
perfectly possible to discuss STEAM, HL2 and any other game for that
matter, from opposite ends of the opinion spectrum. You're incapable
of doing it.

you were probably my favorite poster, the one I most enjoyed
reading, I even tried corresponding with you by email although
you didn't seem very interested...

I actually didn't mind until you sent me that crazy rant about lending
games. You just can't help shoving your opinions down other peoples
throats, can you? I didn't even lend the game in question to a person
so that it could be played, just so that he could confirm a fault with
his DVD Rom and the game.

but now? now you insult and
you lie just like a STEAM LOVER

Enough of this now. This post is already way too long.

Just read what you wrote above. This is why you will never ever be
able to communicate with people in this group. You should seek help,
you have a personality disorder and quite probably don't know it.

--
Rob

EDM wrote:

And most of your other assumptions are equally absurd.
"Every year we have seen less and less releases"????
That's unqualified nonsense. If you want to use Valve as
one example among many, they've been releasing more and
more titles every year, not less.

So basically what you are saying is you prefer someone like
Valve telling you what to do than you deciding for yourself?

Valve has already decided for you when it comes to STEAM
Do you think STEAM lets you lend PC Games to your friends?
NO!
Do you think STEAM lets you use the 2nd hand market?
NO!
So if STEAM imposes the authority set by Master Valve then
no problem... you become a well behaved obeying slave
But if I say you should think TWICE before lending to friends
or using the 2nd hand market cause it MIGHT be damaging for
you cause its damaging for the PC Game market then you don't
accept.
If I ask you to use your own BRAIN, you say NO!
If Valve tell you what to do, you say YES!

Rob wrote:

And there you go again. Why the sneering, condescending
attitude to people that use STEAM? Are you a MICROSOFT
LOVER just because you use XP to play your games? No, of
course you're not. You're just an average gamer that's
stuck with certain things like the rest of us.

Do you know how BAD I would like to get ride of MS?
Do you know how BAD I would like to switch operating systems?
Do you actually know why am I so anxious about Vista?
No, its not cause of the features, its cause of not knowing
what will MS this time throw at us and force us to do.
They have MONOPOLY! They can do whatever they want! with the
only exception being fortunately the EU commission which is
right on top of them.
The EU commission are my HEROES.
Everytime I listen to them fining million to MS again I get
a smile on my face and feel happy.

Have you ever saw me saying GOOD about MS?
NO you haven't.
Almost everything MS is doing is DAMAGING to PC GAMES!
The PC Game decline started when they created a console system
Major part of the PC Game decline is MS FAULT!
Now they want to set the rules in PC Games... that is a total
DISASTER! WE CAN'T LET MS LET RULES IN THE PC GAME MARKET! NO!

The next version of DirectX will only run on Vista so they can
force us all in upgrading!
Even Windows 98 has DirectX 9 support! Windows 98! So how come
XP can't run DX10? Its a total abuse!
But the abuse doesn't stop here...
Now with Vista we will have to play ALL PAST GAMES in emulation
mode! EMULATION MODE! meaning SLOWER! and probably with many
compatibility problems... THIS IS NOT ADMISSIBLE! TOTALLY NOT
ADMISSIBLE!
Vista is a REGRESSION for PC Gamers! REGRESSION!
Again the same issues we had to face 15 years ago with DOS????
after 15 years we still have the same compatibility issues when
we moved from DOS to Win95
This is MS incompetence due to having MONOPOLY. INCOMPETENCE!
And its monopoly that is to blame.

I'm NO HYPOCRITE just cause I use XP and I'm at the same time
against STEAM and Valve. DO YOU UNDERSTAND!
TWO WRONGS don't MAKE A RIGHT! DO YOU UNDERSTAND ROB!
TWO WRONGS don't MAKE A RIGHT!
I will never accept your DISGUSTING attack!
Just cause I use XP I have to ACCEPT VALVE AND STEAM? NO! NO!
AGAIN! TWO WRONGS don't MAKE A RIGHT!

I always have said that the PC Game market has to find another
Operating system.
Unless we don't find another Operating system we PC Gamers will
always be screwed by MS.
And when it comes to STEAM what is your reaction?
YOU SAY EVERYONE SHOULD USE STEAM! YOU BECAME A STEAM LOVER
WHEN YOU START DEFENDING EVERYONE SHOULD USE STEAM! THAT IS WHAT
STEAM LOVER IS!
A simple "Steam user" uses Steam and doesn't defends Valve.
You defend Valve! you do Valves dirty work!
You say Valve is right when they impose and infect STEAM upon
PC Gamers, PC Gamers that didn't ask to use STEAM and do not
want to use STEAM!
I don't want to use STEAM and I have that right!

You have repeatedly defend STEAM as a good system that must be
accepted by all PC Gamers! That is being a STEAM LOVER
WANTING OTHERS TO USE STEAM! FORCING OTHERS TO USE STEAM!
THAT IS YOU! YOU STEAM LOVER!

Until now you were a normal steam user...
Six months ago you even sign the petition I created for a HL2
with no STEAM.
You respected my right and will to play HL2 without STEAM...
And now... Just look at yourself now Rob! LOOK AT YOURSELF!
You came from a PC Gamer that respected me, and even supported
me by signing my petition to one that insults me! to one that
is telling me what to do! that is telling me to shut up and
accept steam! to one that is not respecting my consumer rights!
You have come a long way Rob! What a disappointment!
What a disappointment!
The word I only think of is degradation...
Why?
Why did you become like this? Why?
Don't you see you have to respect me and respect my rights to
not have to be forced in using steam?

Its so sad seeing how STEAM makes PC Gamers like you FANATICS
Fanaticism is what makes a PC Gamers a STEAM LOVER.

I'm really very sad you have became one of them...

Absolutely I can deny it. People are just throwing back
in your face all the things that you sling around at
people that use STEAM. The only way to avoid STEAM is to
not play HL2. A lot of people want to play that game so

WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!
STEAM IS NOT HL2!
HL2 IS NOT STEAM!
HL2 IS JUST ANOTHER GAME IT DOESN'T NEED TO USE STEAM!

And STEAM is starting to be used is many others games!
Valve has big plans for STEAM!
Valve has AMBITION for STEAM!
Valve is targeting Steam to third party developers!
Valve has already become a PUBLISHER with STEAM!
More and more PC Games are being infected with STEAM and more
and more PC Gamers are being left OUT!
Wish I bet its something you really enjoy seeing... I guess it
makes you feel important and special... part of the STEAM cult

I actually didn't mind until you sent me that crazy rant
about lending games. You just can't help shoving your
opinions down other peoples throats, can you? I didn't
even lend the game in question to a person so that it
could be played, just so that he could confirm a fault
with his DVD Rom and the game.

I'm very happy you gave me the reason.. thank you... I always
kept wondering what did happen and now I'm happy you stopped
writing...

Its so funny some PC Gamers like yourself don't let anyone
tell them anything but they let Valve treat them like slaves

Didn't Valve made Steam to cut the lending between friends?
OH YES THEY DID!
Didn't Valve made Steam to cut the 2nd hand market?
OH YES THEY DID!

This is so typical... if I say please don't lend or use the
2nd hand market for PC Games, Gamers like yourself will feel
offended... but yet if it is Valve that doesn't ask you cause
they don't ask anything, they simply IMPOSE, and force you
to OBEY, no problem... so when its Valve IMPOSING then there
is no problem
You're a submissive brainless puppet in Valve hands Rob!
You probably like and enjoy DICTATORSHIP don't you?

But again you have acknowledge again and again so I bet you
will not feel a bit offended by it.
I guess HL2 is a "dreamlike" experience for you so that makes
Valve "GOD", and Gods are to be worship BLINDLY

I tried time and time again to avoid confrontation with you
about STEAM but it didn't make a difference cause you wouldn't
stop until you started a "war"

I don't see the point in talking anymore with you about STEAM
I only talk about STEAM to someone that respect my rights,
which is something like all other STEAM LOVERs you don't.
Seriously you talk about KF... KF me Rob, lets end this.

"pc games" wrote in message ups.com...
EDM wrote:

And most of your other assumptions are equally absurd.
"Every year we have seen less and less releases"????
That's unqualified nonsense. If you want to use Valve as
one example among many, they've been releasing more and
more titles every year, not less.

So basically what you are saying is you prefer someone like
Valve telling you what to do than you deciding for yourself?

Valve has already decided for you when it comes to STEAM
Do you think STEAM lets you lend PC Games to your friends?
NO!
Do you think STEAM lets you use the 2nd hand market?
NO!
So if STEAM imposes the authority set by Master Valve then
no problem... you become a well behaved obeying slave
But if I say you should think TWICE before lending to friends
or using the 2nd hand market cause it MIGHT be damaging for
you cause its damaging for the PC Game market then you don't
accept.
If I ask you to use your own BRAIN, you say NO!
If Valve tell you what to do, you say YES!

And likewise, you condemn piracy and selling 2nd hand
software, and then you blame Valve for preventing what
you've just condemned. How much sense does that make?

Look, I'm the last person who would attempt to defend
Steam. Like every other copy protection scheme ever
devised, Steam will mean far more financial losses than
gains for Valve. My point is, the PC gaming industry has
never been so alive and well, regardless of these pointless
attempts at trying to stop human nature and the inevitable.
Valve will learn their lesson, like Lotus and Novell and
1000 other companies have over the last 30 years.

On 16 Aug 2006 01:05:52 -0700, "pc games"
wrote:
BAD MS
BAD
MONOPOLY!
DISASTER! WE CAN'T LET MS LET RULES IN THE PC GAME MARKET! NO!
ALL PAST GAMES in emulation mode! EMULATION MODE! meaning SLOWER!
THIS IS NOT ADMISSIBLE! TOTALLY NOT ADMISSIBLE!
Vista is a REGRESSION for PC Gamers! REGRESSION!
MONOPOLY. INCOMPETENCE!
. DO YOU UNDERSTAND!
TWO WRONGS don't MAKE A RIGHT! DO YOU UNDERSTAND ROB!
TWO WRONGS don't MAKE A RIGHT!
I will never accept your DISGUSTING attack!
ACCEPT VALVE AND STEAM? NO! NO!
AGAIN! TWO WRONGS don't MAKE A RIGHT!
YOU SAY EVERYONE SHOULD USE STEAM! YOU BECAME A STEAM LOVER
WHEN YOU START DEFENDING EVERYONE SHOULD USE STEAM! THAT IS WHAT
STEAM LOVER IS!
That is being a STEAM LOVER
WANTING OTHERS TO USE STEAM! FORCING OTHERS TO USE STEAM!
WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!
STEAM IS NOT HL2!
HL2 IS NOT STEAM!
HL2 IS JUST ANOTHER GAME IT DOESN'T NEED TO USE STEAM!
OH YES THEY DID!
OH YES THEY DID!

Just sit quietly for a moment and view the main body of your post.

Is it any wonder that nobody wants anything to do with you, including
me?

I'm not going to subject this group to any more of your deranged rants
by replying to your continued k00kiness.

If you could learn to communicate properly then you might, just might,
have something to contribute. Until that happens you'll never be
viewed as anything more than Just Another Net Loon with a rampant
personality disorder.

--
Rob