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curious problem: L1 cache and non-booting.



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 16th 03, 08:45 AM
Toby Newman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default curious problem: L1 cache and non-booting.

Hello. I hope someone can help me here - I'm really not sure what to
try next. I *cannot* get my setup to boot windows XP unless I disable
L1 cacheing in the bios.

My Hardwa
Mobo: Asus A7N8X
CPU: Athlon XP 2200
RAM: 512mb Crucial (CT6464Z40B, 512Mb, 184 pin DIMM, DDR PC3200, SDRAM
timings: CL=3, DIMM type:Unbuffered, Error checking: Non-parity, 5ns,
2.5V, 64Meg x 64)

If I _disable_ L1 cacheing in the BIOS then XP will boot, but only
very slowly (i.e. it takes about 10 minutes to reach the desktop, and
is then very sluggish.)

If I _enable_ L1 cacheing I get an error like:

==========================
Windows XP could not start because the following file is missing or
corrupt:
(either Ntoskrnl.exe or HAL.dll)
Please re-install a copy of the above file.
==========================

I have tried various FSB/Multiplier combinations with no success, but
am using FSB166/M10 at the moment to be on the safe side.

I know very little about memory timings, so for RAS and CAS latency,
RCD etc I am choosing the largest values available to keep things
slow. I assume this is the correct thing to do.

In other areas I am choosing "Optimal" rather than "aggressive".

Do you have any idea what I should try next to make the system work?
Or perhaps you also have an A7N8X and a 2200XP, and could tell me your
own settings?

Please help, I have been stuck on this for a few weeks now...

Toby
  #2  
Old September 16th 03, 11:50 PM
Hippy Paul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


May not be of any use, but I had a similar thing with a cyrix/amd? 486
133Mhz cpu (can't remember what mobo), where I had to turn off L1 to boot
(which was chips on the mobo) - got the same error message on a BSoD. It
was a fresh install of NT4 server, and it was not until I installed SP6 (or
was it SP4) that the problem went away. So maybe if you have not installed
the service pack, etc try that...

I notice that you list "Error Checking" ram - that is unusual outside of a
server platform, have you got your bios settings right for that, are you
sure it is not "non error checking".


"Toby Newman" wrote in message
om...
Hello. I hope someone can help me here - I'm really not sure what to
try next. I *cannot* get my setup to boot windows XP unless I disable
L1 cacheing in the bios.

My Hardwa
Mobo: Asus A7N8X
CPU: Athlon XP 2200
RAM: 512mb Crucial (CT6464Z40B, 512Mb, 184 pin DIMM, DDR PC3200, SDRAM
timings: CL=3, DIMM type:Unbuffered, Error checking: Non-parity, 5ns,
2.5V, 64Meg x 64)

If I _disable_ L1 cacheing in the BIOS then XP will boot, but only
very slowly (i.e. it takes about 10 minutes to reach the desktop, and
is then very sluggish.)

If I _enable_ L1 cacheing I get an error like:

==========================
Windows XP could not start because the following file is missing or
corrupt:
(either Ntoskrnl.exe or HAL.dll)
Please re-install a copy of the above file.
==========================

I have tried various FSB/Multiplier combinations with no success, but
am using FSB166/M10 at the moment to be on the safe side.

I know very little about memory timings, so for RAS and CAS latency,
RCD etc I am choosing the largest values available to keep things
slow. I assume this is the correct thing to do.

In other areas I am choosing "Optimal" rather than "aggressive".

Do you have any idea what I should try next to make the system work?
Or perhaps you also have an A7N8X and a 2200XP, and could tell me your
own settings?

Please help, I have been stuck on this for a few weeks now...

Toby



  #3  
Old September 17th 03, 01:32 PM
Michael Brown
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Hippy Paul" wrote in message
...

"Toby Newman" wrote in message
om...
Hello. I hope someone can help me here - I'm really not sure what to
try next. I *cannot* get my setup to boot windows XP unless I disable
L1 cacheing in the bios.

My Hardwa
Mobo: Asus A7N8X
CPU: Athlon XP 2200
RAM: 512mb Crucial (CT6464Z40B, 512Mb, 184 pin DIMM, DDR PC3200, SDRAM
timings: CL=3, DIMM type:Unbuffered, Error checking: Non-parity, 5ns,
2.5V, 64Meg x 64)

If I _disable_ L1 cacheing in the BIOS then XP will boot, but only
very slowly (i.e. it takes about 10 minutes to reach the desktop, and
is then very sluggish.)

If I _enable_ L1 cacheing I get an error like:

==========================
Windows XP could not start because the following file is missing or
corrupt:
(either Ntoskrnl.exe or HAL.dll)
Please re-install a copy of the above file.
==========================

I have tried various FSB/Multiplier combinations with no success, but
am using FSB166/M10 at the moment to be on the safe side.

I know very little about memory timings, so for RAS and CAS latency,
RCD etc I am choosing the largest values available to keep things
slow. I assume this is the correct thing to do.

In other areas I am choosing "Optimal" rather than "aggressive".

Do you have any idea what I should try next to make the system work?
Or perhaps you also have an A7N8X and a 2200XP, and could tell me your
own settings?

Please help, I have been stuck on this for a few weeks now...


May not be of any use, but I had a similar thing with a cyrix/amd? 486
133Mhz cpu (can't remember what mobo), where I had to turn off L1 to boot
(which was chips on the mobo) - got the same error message on a BSoD. It
was a fresh install of NT4 server, and it was not until I installed SP6

(or
was it SP4) that the problem went away. So maybe if you have not

installed
the service pack, etc try that...


Last time this happened to me it was because of an incorrectly inserted
cache chip on the motherboard (one of the pins was slightly bent so was not
conducting well, causing sporadic errors). I doubt it's the same in your
case though However, try running memtest86, as this should pick up if
anything is bad in the cache RAM department (in which case you should RMA
the CPU).

I notice that you list "Error Checking" ram - that is unusual outside of a
server platform, have you got your bios settings right for that, are you
sure it is not "non error checking".


Should be "servers and workstations" here ... I've got a PPro that sure
ain't a server and it is currently using parity EDO ram. Anyhow, he said
"Error checking: Non-parity" which I presume means it's not ECC or parity
ram

--
Michael Brown
www.emboss.co.nz : OOS/RSI software and more
Add michael@ to emboss.co.nz - My inbox is always open


  #4  
Old September 17th 03, 07:01 PM
Hippy Paul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Michael Brown" wrote in message
...
"Hippy Paul" wrote in message
...


I notice that you list "Error Checking" ram - that is unusual outside of

a
server platform, have you got your bios settings right for that, are you
sure it is not "non error checking".


Should be "servers and workstations" here ... I've got a PPro that sure
ain't a server and it is currently using parity EDO ram. Anyhow, he said
"Error checking: Non-parity" which I presume means it's not ECC or parity
ram


so he did, either my eyes are getting worse or I need to clean my screen.

But, yes, it needs to be tested if it has not been, however, I assumed it
would have been


  #5  
Old September 17th 03, 11:26 PM
TMack
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Toby Newman" wrote in message
om...
Hello. I hope someone can help me here - I'm really not sure what to
try next. I *cannot* get my setup to boot windows XP unless I disable
L1 cacheing in the bios.

My Hardwa
Mobo: Asus A7N8X
CPU: Athlon XP 2200
RAM: 512mb Crucial (CT6464Z40B, 512Mb, 184 pin DIMM, DDR PC3200, SDRAM
timings: CL=3, DIMM type:Unbuffered, Error checking: Non-parity, 5ns,
2.5V, 64Meg x 64)

If I _disable_ L1 cacheing in the BIOS then XP will boot, but only
very slowly (i.e. it takes about 10 minutes to reach the desktop, and
is then very sluggish.)

If I _enable_ L1 cacheing I get an error like:

==========================
Windows XP could not start because the following file is missing or
corrupt:
(either Ntoskrnl.exe or HAL.dll)
Please re-install a copy of the above file.
==========================

I have tried various FSB/Multiplier combinations with no success, but
am using FSB166/M10 at the moment to be on the safe side.

I know very little about memory timings, so for RAS and CAS latency,
RCD etc I am choosing the largest values available to keep things
slow. I assume this is the correct thing to do.

In other areas I am choosing "Optimal" rather than "aggressive".

Do you have any idea what I should try next to make the system work?
Or perhaps you also have an A7N8X and a 2200XP, and could tell me your
own settings?

Please help, I have been stuck on this for a few weeks now...


Just checking the basics - you say you have fsb set to 166Mhz - is your
XP2200 meant to run at a default 133MHz? If it is a 133MHz fsb (266MHz cpu
bus) cpu then 166 might be more than it can handle. How does it run at
13.5x133 ?

Tony


  #6  
Old September 19th 03, 12:01 PM
Toby Newman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"TMack" wrote in message ...
"Toby Newman" wrote in message
om...
Hello. I hope someone can help me here - I'm really not sure what to
try next. I *cannot* get my setup to boot windows XP unless I disable
L1 cacheing in the bios.

My Hardwa
Mobo: Asus A7N8X
CPU: Athlon XP 2200
RAM: 512mb Crucial (CT6464Z40B, 512Mb, 184 pin DIMM, DDR PC3200, SDRAM
timings: CL=3, DIMM type:Unbuffered, Error checking: Non-parity, 5ns,
2.5V, 64Meg x 64)

If I _disable_ L1 cacheing in the BIOS then XP will boot, but only
very slowly (i.e. it takes about 10 minutes to reach the desktop, and
is then very sluggish.)

If I _enable_ L1 cacheing I get an error like:

==========================
Windows XP could not start because the following file is missing or
corrupt:
(either Ntoskrnl.exe or HAL.dll)
Please re-install a copy of the above file.
==========================

I have tried various FSB/Multiplier combinations with no success, but
am using FSB166/M10 at the moment to be on the safe side.

I know very little about memory timings, so for RAS and CAS latency,
RCD etc I am choosing the largest values available to keep things
slow. I assume this is the correct thing to do.

In other areas I am choosing "Optimal" rather than "aggressive".

Do you have any idea what I should try next to make the system work?
Or perhaps you also have an A7N8X and a 2200XP, and could tell me your
own settings?

Please help, I have been stuck on this for a few weeks now...


Just checking the basics - you say you have fsb set to 166Mhz - is your
XP2200 meant to run at a default 133MHz? If it is a 133MHz fsb (266MHz cpu
bus) cpu then 166 might be more than it can handle. How does it run at
13.5x133 ?

Tony


Just so you don't think I posted a question and then ignored all the
answers, I'll reply temporarily now...

I set the FSB to 13.5x133 last night but still no joy. When I ran
memtest it came up with errors after about 3 minutes of testing. I
tried a different DIMM, different manufacturer, and still got errors.
I'll do the test again tonight, when I'm less busy, and get better
details of the error reported.

Thanks for your input so far
Toby
  #7  
Old September 20th 03, 06:37 PM
Toby Newman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Okay, here's the info:

I tried setting the FSB to minimum (100x6 or something ridiculous!),
disabling L1 cache, and swapping the memory for a different DIMM, made
by a different manufacturer, and in a different DIMM slot on the
motherboard.

Under each of the above circumstances, I ran Memtest, and each time a
stream of errors were reported after about 2 minutes, once it reached
"test 4":

Test: 4
Pass: 0
Failing Address:0001ffba488 - 511.6MB
Good: fffffb
Bad: f6f6f6f6
Err bits: 0909090d
Count: 1
Chan: (nothing in this column)

....and so on for increasing values of "Failing Address" etc. The
errors just stream by.

What on earth is causing this problem? To reiterate, disabling L1
cache in the bios allows XP to boot very slowly, but enabling it
causes a ntoskrnl or hal.dll is "corrupt or missing" error.

Please advise me! I need your help

Toby
  #8  
Old September 22nd 03, 06:49 PM
TMack
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Toby Newman" wrote in message
om...
Okay, here's the info:

I tried setting the FSB to minimum (100x6 or something ridiculous!),
disabling L1 cache, and swapping the memory for a different DIMM, made
by a different manufacturer, and in a different DIMM slot on the
motherboard.

Under each of the above circumstances, I ran Memtest, and each time a
stream of errors were reported after about 2 minutes, once it reached
"test 4":

Test: 4
Pass: 0
Failing Address:0001ffba488 - 511.6MB
Good: fffffb
Bad: f6f6f6f6
Err bits: 0909090d
Count: 1
Chan: (nothing in this column)

...and so on for increasing values of "Failing Address" etc. The
errors just stream by.

What on earth is causing this problem? To reiterate, disabling L1
cache in the bios allows XP to boot very slowly, but enabling it
causes a ntoskrnl or hal.dll is "corrupt or missing" error.


At a guess I would say your motherboard's memory control circuits are flaky.
It is possible but less likely that the cpu is flaky. . You could test
this by trying your existing cpu and memory in another motherboard.

Tony


  #9  
Old September 22nd 03, 10:37 PM
Rabramson1
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

i am positive that it is a RAM error. the ram is either faulty or has a
leak. this happened to me more than a few times, so i found just to buy good
ram from an established dealer. ciao!

"TMack" wrote in message
.. .

"Toby Newman" wrote in message
om...
Okay, here's the info:

I tried setting the FSB to minimum (100x6 or something ridiculous!),
disabling L1 cache, and swapping the memory for a different DIMM, made
by a different manufacturer, and in a different DIMM slot on the
motherboard.

Under each of the above circumstances, I ran Memtest, and each time a
stream of errors were reported after about 2 minutes, once it reached
"test 4":

Test: 4
Pass: 0
Failing Address:0001ffba488 - 511.6MB
Good: fffffb
Bad: f6f6f6f6
Err bits: 0909090d
Count: 1
Chan: (nothing in this column)

...and so on for increasing values of "Failing Address" etc. The
errors just stream by.

What on earth is causing this problem? To reiterate, disabling L1
cache in the bios allows XP to boot very slowly, but enabling it
causes a ntoskrnl or hal.dll is "corrupt or missing" error.


At a guess I would say your motherboard's memory control circuits are

flaky.
It is possible but less likely that the cpu is flaky. . You could test
this by trying your existing cpu and memory in another motherboard.

Tony




  #10  
Old September 29th 03, 02:15 PM
Toby Newman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Just to close the episode, I bought a new CPU yesterday and for the
meantime it seems to have solved the issue. I guess I must've fried
part of the CPU while I was tinkering with bios settings.

....The CPU was not modified though, so it would not have been possible
to overclock it accidentally, would it?

Toby
 




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