Recovery disk Library Location?

Ben Myers wrote:
On Tue, 26 Sep 2006 11:18:28 -0500, "BillW50" wrote:

Ben Myers wrote:
One more thing: Except for illegal web sites run by and for hackers
and crackers, you won't find any system restore CDs out here on the
web. Contractually, Microsoft prohibits their OEMs from making CDs
available, and would have any OEM posting a restore CD on the net in
court real fast.

Some system restore CDs are Windows install CDs, plain and simple,
and they generally require drivers, either from another CD shipped
with the computer or downloaded from the web. Others use another
process (restoring a Ghost image, for example) to restore the CD to
its factory state... Ben Myers

Nonsense you can find hard to find recovery disc at places like:

http://www.gennersales.co.uk/

Thnak you for the reminder that the EU and the US are different
places. All they have in common is one letter in the abbreviation.
Microsoft has been forced to do business VERY differently in the EU,
where there is still governmental concern for the rights of
individuals compared to megacorporations. It does not surprise me
that recovery CDs would be available in Europe.

Because the US government is extremely friendly to businesses, to put
it mildly, Microsoft twists everyone's testes here. Or tits.
Whichever. And recovery CDs are not available in the general
marketplace except from the name brand manufacturer, provided one
whines loudly enough.

What I stated was US-centric, because I have been back here for the
last 22 years.

I would not mind if someone proved me wrong by posting the URL of a
US(!!!)-based web site that sells XP recovery CDs legally at a price
much less than a full-fledged store copy of XPee. I would be up near
the front of the line, to fill out the collection I already have...
Ben Myers

Well they do sell to the US as well Ben. And here in the US, there was a
place that specialized in Toshiba (non-officially). And they sold
recovery discs too. I guess they don't do this anymore at:

http://www.usedtoshiba.com/

How this UK outfit and those in the US that does this I believe works
like this. You, I, or whomever can legally sell, give, or whatever
Windows OS and/or recovery install disc to anybody with a valid Windows
license to whomever we want too. What is forbidden is to copy licenses
and Product Key Codes. But in the last 7 years or so, the computer
should have the sticker on it with the license and Product Key Code on
them anyway.

--
Bill

On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 10:52:24 -0500, "BillW50" wrote:

SNIP

Well they do sell to the US as well Ben. And here in the US, there was a
place that specialized in Toshiba (non-officially). And they sold
recovery discs too. I guess they don't do this anymore at:

http://www.usedtoshiba.com/

How this UK outfit and those in the US that does this I believe works
like this. You, I, or whomever can legally sell, give, or whatever
Windows OS and/or recovery install disc to anybody with a valid Windows
license to whomever we want too. What is forbidden is to copy licenses
and Product Key Codes. But in the last 7 years or so, the computer
should have the sticker on it with the license and Product Key Code on
them anyway.

This is my understanding, too. If the computer has a COA sticker, it can have a
matching version of Windows loaded up on it. The issues often come about
because Microsoft has different COA Product Key Codes for essentially identical
software. For example, there are upgrade/retail, non-upgrade/retail, and OEM
versions of XP Home. One MUST use a CD that matches the version, or else after
manually entering the code, Windows says that the code is not valid. (Then
there is the whole mess of WGA, yet another obstacle.) There has been a lot of
discussion on-line elsewhere as to whether or not an OEM restore CD from one
name brand mfr can be used to restore onto another brand of computer. A lot of
mixed opinions, and nobody has the time to do a methodical and detailed
analysis... Ben Myers

Kevin Childers wrote:
"BillW50" wrote in message
. com...
Ben Myers wrote:
[snip]
Have you considered loading up systems with something like Ubuntu
Linux? No license fee. No COA. Nobody and no software to
harrass you. Relatively easy installation process with fewer
reboots than a Windows XP install-and-update-all-the-patches.
Currently there is equivalent software for Office (except Access),
Photoshop, various media players, and all manner of other stuff.
All included on the distribution CDs. You can download for free
and burn your own CDs. There are other comparable variations of
Linux, too... Ben Myers

When will people realize that the commercial world doesn't support
Linux! I first heard of Linux back around '95 and today I still
won't touch it. As everything I buy, from flight simulators, VoIP,
cameras, IM software, etc. only come with Windows software and
rarely with Mac crippled versions. There are no Linux versions for
any of this stuff. Why the hell would someone want to run Linux for?
Why would you want to dumb your computer down to a glorified PDA
for? I just don't get it? --
Bill

I think you should take another look around at this issue. There
are numerous alternatives to the MS series of offerings as well as
quite a few windows based apps being ported over to other O/Ss. Some
of the biggest pushes to this have been the licensing system used by
MS as well as cost and support. Google a bit on the web and you can
find an alternative to MS for just about any app with a very similar
interface.

Well having lots of applications for an OS was good enough years ago.
But things are different today. Now you need driver support and things
that I have already mentioned. And plain applications just won't cut it
anymore for me anyway. I need all of my devices connected to my computer
to work too. Neither a Mac or Linux can do that for me. Thus the only
choice for me is Windows. And if the third party manufactures continue
to support just Windows, things are not going to change for me.

--
Bill

Ben Myers wrote:
On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 10:52:24 -0500, "BillW50" wrote:

SNIP

Well they do sell to the US as well Ben. And here in the US, there
was a place that specialized in Toshiba (non-officially). And they
sold recovery discs too. I guess they don't do this anymore at:

http://www.usedtoshiba.com/

How this UK outfit and those in the US that does this I believe works
like this. You, I, or whomever can legally sell, give, or whatever
Windows OS and/or recovery install disc to anybody with a valid
Windows license to whomever we want too. What is forbidden is to
copy licenses and Product Key Codes. But in the last 7 years or so,
the computer should have the sticker on it with the license and
Product Key Code on them anyway.

This is my understanding, too. If the computer has a COA sticker, it
can have a matching version of Windows loaded up on it. The issues
often come about because Microsoft has different COA Product Key
Codes for essentially identical software. For example, there are
upgrade/retail, non-upgrade/retail, and OEM versions of XP Home. One
MUST use a CD that matches the version, or else after manually
entering the code, Windows says that the code is not valid...
SNIP

Oh yeah... I forgot about that. Someone asked me to help them restore
their Windows 98SE after something hosed their OS on the HD. And when I
got there, Windows wouldn't load because many files were missing.

I said no problem, where is your Windows CD? They pulled out hundreds of
CD installs, but nothing for Windows 98. So I said wait a minute, I have
one in the car and installed it and put in their Key Code and it
wouldn't work! I don't mind Microsoft going after the crooks! But when
they screw with honest people I get really ****ed! All this does is
cause honest people to purchase multiple licenses for the same damn
computer.

--
Bill

BillW50 wrote:
... I don't mind Microsoft going after the crooks! But
when they screw with honest people I get really ****ed! All this does
is cause honest people to purchase multiple licenses for the same damn
computer.

I should have added that I have two computers right here with 2 licences
of XP for each of them because of this nonsense. Someone should take
Bill Gates and hang him by his...

And if you read the license agreement, all you need is a newer unused
license and then is good enough to install an older version of Windows
on the computer. Okay great, if I have a computer that I rather have
Windows 98SE on it. I can't purchase a license for Windows 98SE, but I
can legally purchase Windows XP and then borrow a Windows 98SE install
CD and I'm legal. Problem is the damn Product Key Code for Windows XP
doesn't work with Windows 98SE. So why do they tell me it is okay for?
And have me spend the money on something I can't use? Can you say
*******s?

--
Bill

Device support is a big area. The Linux developers do a real good job of
jumping onto driver development for all the latest greatest chipsets, printers,
NICs, scanners, etc. Still, I have had exactly two Linux device problems over
the years, one many years ago and one about three years ago. In both cases, the
device was so new that the Linux distro being used did not have a built in
device driver. Many years ago, I swapped out a graphics card for a slightly
older one, maybe six months old. More recently, I ADDED a NIC so that a P4
could function as a router/firewall. At the time, the Linux-based firewall
vendor did not support a then-new Intel Ethernet chip on the motherboard. ANY
Postscript printer is supported by Linux, out of the box, just like Macs. HP
printers are well-supported by Linux, but I do not know about the HP all-in-one
PSC devices. Scanners have a standardized Twain-like software interface, so
most work seamlessly and easily, unlike the dreadful hodge-podge of scanning
software from everyone and his brother under Windows.

With Windows XP, if the system is new enough, one has to go through a lot of
additional work to install drivers for any hardware not included in the original
XP. So what's the difference here with device support??? Just like any other
part of this world, you look before you leap, whether it is Windows or Linux,
examine closely the support for the hardware you need and the work you need to
do with the software.

Why do I feel like this is deteriorating into a red-blue type dialog? Or could
this be a Microsoft employee responding?

Don't get me wrong. I still sell 90+% Windows-based systems. Microsoft
continues to do its best to make the alternatives more attractive... Ben Myers

On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 12:43:52 -0500, "BillW50" wrote:

Kevin Childers wrote:
"BillW50" wrote in message
. com...
Ben Myers wrote:
[snip]
Have you considered loading up systems with something like Ubuntu
Linux? No license fee. No COA. Nobody and no software to
harrass you. Relatively easy installation process with fewer
reboots than a Windows XP install-and-update-all-the-patches.
Currently there is equivalent software for Office (except Access),
Photoshop, various media players, and all manner of other stuff.
All included on the distribution CDs. You can download for free
and burn your own CDs. There are other comparable variations of
Linux, too... Ben Myers

When will people realize that the commercial world doesn't support
Linux! I first heard of Linux back around '95 and today I still
won't touch it. As everything I buy, from flight simulators, VoIP,
cameras, IM software, etc. only come with Windows software and
rarely with Mac crippled versions. There are no Linux versions for
any of this stuff. Why the hell would someone want to run Linux for?
Why would you want to dumb your computer down to a glorified PDA
for? I just don't get it? --
Bill

I think you should take another look around at this issue. There
are numerous alternatives to the MS series of offerings as well as
quite a few windows based apps being ported over to other O/Ss. Some
of the biggest pushes to this have been the licensing system used by
MS as well as cost and support. Google a bit on the web and you can
find an alternative to MS for just about any app with a very similar
interface.

Well having lots of applications for an OS was good enough years ago.
But things are different today. Now you need driver support and things
that I have already mentioned. And plain applications just won't cut it
anymore for me anyway. I need all of my devices connected to my computer
to work too. Neither a Mac or Linux can do that for me. Thus the only
choice for me is Windows. And if the third party manufactures continue
to support just Windows, things are not going to change for me.

I'll repeat what I stated in another response. Microsoft is doing its best to
make alternative operating systems more attractive. Your experience is a good
example of this. And evidently you are not a Micro$oft employee... Ben Myers

On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 14:31:14 -0500, "BillW50" wrote:

BillW50 wrote:
... I don't mind Microsoft going after the crooks! But
when they screw with honest people I get really ****ed! All this does
is cause honest people to purchase multiple licenses for the same damn
computer.

I should have added that I have two computers right here with 2 licences
of XP for each of them because of this nonsense. Someone should take
Bill Gates and hang him by his...

And if you read the license agreement, all you need is a newer unused
license and then is good enough to install an older version of Windows
on the computer. Okay great, if I have a computer that I rather have
Windows 98SE on it. I can't purchase a license for Windows 98SE, but I
can legally purchase Windows XP and then borrow a Windows 98SE install
CD and I'm legal. Problem is the damn Product Key Code for Windows XP
doesn't work with Windows 98SE. So why do they tell me it is okay for?
And have me spend the money on something I can't use? Can you say
*******s?

Ben Myers wrote:
Device support is a big area. The Linux developers do a real good
job of jumping onto driver development for all the latest greatest
chipsets, printers, NICs, scanners, etc. Still, I have had exactly
two Linux device problems over the years, one many years ago and one
about three years ago. In both cases, the device was so new that the
Linux distro being used did not have a built in device driver. Many
years ago, I swapped out a graphics card for a slightly older one,
maybe six months old. More recently, I ADDED a NIC so that a P4
could function as a router/firewall. At the time, the Linux-based
firewall vendor did not support a then-new Intel Ethernet chip on the
motherboard. ANY Postscript printer is supported by Linux, out of
the box, just like Macs. HP printers are well-supported by Linux,
but I do not know about the HP all-in-one PSC devices. Scanners
have a standardized Twain-like software interface, so most work
seamlessly and easily, unlike the dreadful hodge-podge of scanning
software from everyone and his brother under Windows.

With Windows XP, if the system is new enough, one has to go through a
lot of additional work to install drivers for any hardware not
included in the original XP. So what's the difference here with
device support??? Just like any other part of this world, you look
before you leap, whether it is Windows or Linux, examine closely the
support for the hardware you need and the work you need to do with
the software.

Why do I feel like this is deteriorating into a red-blue type dialog?
Or could this be a Microsoft employee responding?

Don't get me wrong. I still sell 90+% Windows-based systems.
Microsoft continues to do its best to make the alternatives more
attractive... Ben Myers

What can I tell you Ben? Here is how things works for me. Like my last
girlfriend lived 1200 miles away and got me hooked on Yahoo with voice.
Better yet we could yak for hours for free. So I bought a Yahoo phone
from VTech. Now I have a wireless VoIP phone I can use hundreds of feet
from the base. I also signed up for a new phone number through Yahoo
which allows me free incoming calls for like 30 bucks a year and only 2¢
per minute to non-Yahoo computers (landlane, cells, etc.).

Well I broke up with her later, but I still have the phone and Yahoo. My
computer has to be on for the phone to work (although it does connect up
to the landline which doesn't need the computer for that part). But how
do I run this from Linux? The thing is I can't. Only Windows 2000 or
Windows XP only.

That isn't all... what about my Palm IIIc and IIIxe? The software only
works with Windows. Doesn't work with Linux at all. And what about my
digital camera? Windows software only. What about my USB tuner card?
Windows only. See what I am talking about here? How in the world could I
work at all under Linux? I can't!

Are you tired of listening yet? If you are not, here is some more. One I
don't like OE very much for newsgroups and even email. There are a lot
of things I would change with it. But dang it, all others I have tried
are far worse than OE. And I don't if their is anything as good (if you
want to call it good) on the Linux side. At least OE-QuiteFix helps a
lot with OE.

--
Bill

BillW50 wrote:
... At least OE-QuiteFix helps a lot with OE.

That should be OE-QuoteFix. Sorry! lol

--
Bill

Ben Myers wrote :
Finally, just for fun (or possibly more aggravation), call Gateway and ask if
they will sell you recovery/restore CDs. Give them the computer serial
number, which is entirely legit.

FWIW, Dell and HPaq sell their recovery CDs... Ben Myers

On Mon, 25 Sep 2006 12:24:02 -0700, Postman delivers
wrote:

The last three computers I have assembled, or put back together have
all shown up with WGA errors.

Since it is almost impossible to secure recover disks with all the
advertising, I have been using several Windows CDs to install the
product listed on the COA with legitimate codes. Now installing with
the COA, I am getting Windows Counterfeit messages doing the updates
because I am using the same disk.

I was able to find a HP recover disk for one of the computers I
assembled from several different computers, not the originals but the
correct ones for that specific model. I have two computers (one
Gateway e-4000) that I cannot give to the school for their
disadvantaged students because of the WGA errors.

In talking to MS, the support person indicated it is the MS policy that
the original disks must be used and not one disk for many computer
systems. Since I almost never get the recovery disks, with the broken
or destroyed computers I rebuild, or piece together, nor do I have a
benefactor that will pay for recovery disks/a new copy of windows I
have a problem.

Is there a location on the net where someone or a group has stored
recovery disks that manufactures no longer have or will ship, so that
they can be secure, when trying to rebuild the computers?

I understand that (WGA) is to prevent Operating System Piracy, but this
is too much and a very recent development.

Maybe it is time for me to choose another endeavor...

Yes, I know there are a number of work arounds for the current and past
versions of (WGA).

JR the Postman

I have and it is not available...

I have also created a MS exception or case number to see if I can find
another solution.

I have several bird dogs working garage sales currently, looking to
acquire every computer OS or recovery disk possible. The Funny part is
the people have lost/miss placed them, or tossed them when they
discarded or upgraded their computers...

I have not been doing this long enough, or am not close enough to the
party donating the systems to ask/plead for the operating system disks.

But education is going to work, and I am going to acquire a collection
of recovery disks. I am using a OEM when possible and have no real
problem accomplishing that type of recover with a COA.

But when I have no recovery partition and no recovery disks, I was
using a non-upgrade/retail disk and that recently has not passed the
(WGA) it always did previously and now I received a new (WGA) error
maybe for using same disk for more than one install, using the COA #
from the computer case.

I am going to look into Linux, the students will not care and I still
enjoy performing this service of getting these tired systems running
again, and placing them into a students home...

JR

--
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